Tim Hassett-Salley, 2x Award-winning author of ‘Strike Two, You're Out’ and ‘Samsara Interrupted'

0:00 The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services, or products mentioned on air or on our web. No liability explicitor implies shall be extended to W four cy Radio or its employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing W FOURCY Radio. Churchill said, those who fail to learn from history are condemned to repeat it. Kevin helen N believes that certainly applies to business. Welcome to Winning Business Radio here at W four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com and now your host, Kevin helen N.

0:51 Thanks everybody for joining in today. I am Kevin Hallanan and welcome back to Winning Business TV and Radio on W four cy dot com. We are streaming live on talk for tv dot com. In addition, we're available live on Facebook and that's at Winning Business Radio. And of course we're available in podcasts after the live show on tons of platforms pretty much wherever you get your podcast content. We are there. That's YouTube. iHeartRadio, Spotify, Apple, Google, etc. The list goes on the mission of winning business radio and TV, as regular viewers and listeners know, is to offer insights and advice to help people avoid the mistakes of others, right to learn best practices. Those are the I like to say, the how tos, the what tos, the what not tos, to be challenged and hopefully to be inspired by the successes of others. Consultants, coaches, advisors, authors, founders and olders, owners excuse me, entrepreneurs, people with expertise.

1:48 But of course, virtually every successful person I've ever had a chance to talk to has said some form of failure in their lives, career lives, and careers, some small, some larger. So listen. While we all have to get our skin once in a while, every week, I say, I'm driven to keep those scrapes from needing major surgery. Let's endeavor to learn from history so we don't repeat it. I've spent a better part of my career equipping businesses to grow from solopreneurs to small and medium sized companies all the way to the fortune fifty. I've seen some of those companies win, and to varying degrees, I've seen some fail I've had the opportunity to rub elbows with some of the highest performing people around in some probably should have found other professions. In my own businesses, I've had lots of lots of success, but we're some failures too, and I like to think I've learned a lot from those experiences. So, yeah, you're going to hear from me my opinions and insights, because anybody who knows me, right, Tim, we'll tell you I have a hard time staying quiet.

2:40 But more importantly, together we'll hear from experts, those consultants, coaches, advisors, authors, founders and owners and entrepreneurs. Today, my guest is Tim Hassett Sally. Old friend. Tim Hassett Sally two time award winning author of Strike, two Year Out and Samsara Interrupted. Here's his bio. Tim Hassett Sally was born in nineteen sixty in rural northeastern Connecticut. He received his BA in psychology and music from Providence College and earned his graduate degrees in counseling from Bridgewater State University. For many years, he maintained a private psychotherapy practice counseling violent, excuse me, violent and Abusive Men. After publishing his first novel, Strike two Year Out, Tim received the twenty twenty Doctor Adrian Tinsley Award for Achievement in the Arts. His second novel, Samsara Interrupted, was published in twenty twenty four. Both novels have received many excellent reviews. Tim is married and has three adult children and three grandchildren. Hear about them. He's a sprint triathlete, an avid tennis player and plays the drums in his spare time. He's an underachiever. Tim is currently the director of Revenue Development at the Workers Compensation Research Institute. He's held leadership positions for over thirty five years within the workers' compensation and disability management industry. In addition, Tim was an adjunct faculty member of the Counseling Department of the Graduate School of Education at Bridgewater State University.

4:00 Tim has presented it in many conferences and institutions, including National comp International Claim Association, ARKANSAW. I can say that Arkansaw Self Insurance Association, New England Claim Association. The list goes on several colleges and universities. Tim welcome to Winning Business Radio. Thank you very much. Kevin, glad to be here. I'm glad you are, and I appreciate I know how busy you are. I appreciate you taking the time. So we're going to talk a bit about business, and we're certainly going to talk about your books a lot. But first, tell us about your family. Well, they're all growing, with the ones that are growing the most right now with the grandkids. Everybody else is stable but great. I get three great adult children and they're all found wonderful partners in life and three growing grandkids.

4:48 Nice. Nice, does your wife work or had a career of what does she do? Or she's a retired French teacher? Oh wow, Iol retired as soon as the first grand son was born. Nice. She's not really tired then, right, she's. Been she shifted. Yeah. So you grew up in rural, as you like to say, rural northeastern Connecticut. Tell us the town and what it was like to grow up there. So I grew up in a town called Ellington, Connecticut, and you know, it was mostly cows and tobacco. Uh and uh. I just had the opportunity to drive through there about a month ago, and I was just shocked at how much development there was, and so many. Growing up you could see corn forever and ever and ever, corn corn, corn cows. And then I actually picked tobacco as a teenager.

5:38 And you know, I think most of that has gone now. Yeah, I was gonna ask, Yeah, most of that's in the Carolina's it's that's still a shrinking business, but it's interesting. One of the good to Great companies in Jim Collins book To Great was a tobacco company. Believe it or not. Yeah, we we were into Connecticut broadly cigar tobacco. We the rappers that are still used today, the Connecticut seed. If you get a real good quality cigar, you might see it as Connecticut rapper or Connecticut seed. So it was. It was quite a business. It's a terrible job to have. It's one of those jobs you have when you're before you go off to college and you remind you that you really want.

6:21 To be in don't want to do that? Yeah, mine. Mine was working in a meat room in a grocery store, a family run, two location grocery store. And it was dirty and gross. You went home smelling all day. All the time, and the dogs follow you home. They I didn't have that happen, but I was surprised it never did. What were your early interests. Uh, I would say baseball and uh riding bikes and fishing. I mean it was in that regard. That was a great place to grow up because we did plenty of all of that. And uh, you know, I had a lot of kids in the family, and so we were not inside the house very mud. We were out. If we were in the house, my mother always said, I'll find something for you to do.

7:06 It wasn't what you'd want to do. My mother would always say. And I heard a comedian talking about it, Get out of the house, go outside. That doesn't happen as much anymore. And when did you get into music and start playing the drums? So I started playing drums when I was ten years old, and I graduated from hitting the pots and pans and my metal lunch bus nice my father showed up with a nineteen thirties vintage drum set, a big band type of drum set, and I took private lessons after that, and I drummed all through high school and college and even right up until the pandemic. I was playing in a band. That's awesome. That's awesome. You may know. For full disclosure, Tim and I have known each other for twenty years.

7:51 Of twenty something years. We used to hang out in the same networking organizations and we did a little work together. So I played trumpet. If you may recall, I was telling people today watching the inauguration a little bit that I marched in Reagan's eighty one parade because I was at the UMSS. I was at UMass in the mini man marching mad. So that was cold, but a ton of ton of fun. Pretty pretty historic. Yeah, do you play other instruments? Well, I was a music major, so you know, I had to learn piano. I'm a terrible piano player, but I play a little flute and I play some guitar as well. Nice. So you're you're the guy they went in the band. They won't give me a microphone. They don't want me to sink, so I'll just I'll just sit in the back and play the drums.

8:36 So what made you decide to go to Providence College and to major in psychology? Well, the major in psychology part for me. If you remember Bob Newhart in his first I Do I Do Love that show, I loved it too. He was he was a funny psychologist and it seemed like he was having a great time. And I said, that's what comedy routines is. He's one of my favorites because he would do that one side converse, which was part of different bits that he would do, but he would do it perfectly. Yeah. Sorry, that was so that was kind of what first got me interested in psychology. And Providence College was one of these situations where when I was about junior high maybe just going into freshman year, Province College basketball was really big and Erdi Gregorio was there. They went to the final four, and that really put him on the map for me. And I had one really good teacher in high school who had gone to Providence, and you know, I think that impacted me that, you know, smart people could go there and maybe you.

9:37 Come out smart. I don't know. I just but they accepted me, and so I said, let's go. Yeah, that's what it was for me, and you mass, they took me in. Let's go. So I want to ask about this because it must have been. As I hear it, it sounds like it was very challenging that you had a private practice specializing in violent and abuse of men. How to end were probably referred to you by I don't know, I'm just envisioning courts or family or somebody, right. Sure, sure, So a lot of a lot of them were referred by the courts, by probation officers. Also, some were referred by the women's center. I was the only male employee for a while at the Celshore Women's Center, and so I would get the abusive spouse of someone who might have been in the Women's Center seeking treatment as a victim, and it was a it's a heavy subject, and it's you know, I think that's something that when you're talking to you aspiring therapists really talk to them about how to you know, compartmentalize your your emotions from theirs.

10:46 And my professors used to say, it's not your problem, it's their problem. You're just there to help them with their problem. But it is difficult to make that transition from talking about some really really heavy things and then literally fifteen minutes later have to be in your house being a husband and a father. So I think the danger is is when you compartmentalize that and keep the emotion the terrible emotions that you just heard, the terrible circumstances to keep that out of your head. You're also at the same time risking keeping your own emotions dampened.

11:27 And I think it takes. A lot of work to try to be in touch with your emotions, especially as a man, and to have a normal life while you just listen to some really terrible stuff. I've always shoard that most therapists have a therapist. Is that the case? Yeah, I think they do or should yes, yeah, yeah. So I normally ask what your most important lesson learned, and you just explained it, you know, a couple minutes ago. So thanks for that. And then you've spent many years in business development, particularly in and around insurance and the social security niche how did that come about, because it's been mental welly something year. Yeah. Yeah, So I started as I was as a counselor, a vocational counselor in the business and working with people who were out of work and wanting to get back to work and that kind of you know. We it was at a time when in the industry when there weren't that many referrals to vocational rehab and I complained about it not having enough work, and you know, we were on a billable hour type of thing. I wasn't getting enough work, and they basically said, do you think you can do better? You get into business development. So yeah, that was about thirty five years ago. I got into the business development side of it, and I think the having had the background in psychology has really helped me as a salesperson.

12:53 I really think there's. A very close connection between sales and psychology. I do as well, and you and I have talked about the Sandler selling methodology. That's the world I come from and you're familiar with, and a lot of it is psychologically based, just anticipating reactions and kind of appealing to some of that in a healthy way. What are some of the most important lessons you've learned in business development and in development? By the way, explain the difference to the audience between business development and in a nonprofit world development. So I don't make a big distinction between those because in a nonprofit nonprofit is just a business classification.

13:37 You still need to make money. We still have at the institute. We have almost thirty employees and they need to be you know, we need to have funding to pay for all of them so they can do the great work that they're doing. So that's for me. What's personally rewarding is that I'm no longer doing direct care with people in need, but I am providing funding to a group of people who each of them are making money and bringing at home and able to feed their families. So it's kind of an extension effect. So your sale, if you will, is bringing in funds. Correct. So I've get funding from state governments and large insurance companies and they provide us some you know, it's based on the size of the insurance company, but some bigger ones are paying more and the smaller ones are paying less.

14:28 But it all adds up and we're able to uh to take on the research projects that we do, and we're really providing a public service, if you will, because it's our work is available to not just the people who are paying for it through funding us, but also on of that hock basis as they as they pay for what they need as they go along. Got it, Got it all right? Welcome back, and just a couple minutes. I have a lot more questions. Everybody will be back in a out a minute with Tim Hassett. Sally. You're listening to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helene on W four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com.

15:14 Don't go away. More helpful information is coming right up right here on Winning Business Radio. Have you ever dreamt of being on the radio, Well, now it's your chance. Be a radio show guest on the number one ranked internet radio station and promote you and your business for free. Yes you heard it, free business advertising right here on W four cy dot com. Call five six one five zero six four zero three one now to get booked on one of our shows. That's five six one five zero six four zero three one. Get your free advertising now.

15:55 And now back to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helene, presenting exciting to some expert guests with one goal in mind to help you succeed in business. Here once again is Kevin Hellenett. Welcome back today. My guest is Tim Hassett Sally, two time award winning author of Strike two. You're Out and Sam Sara interrupted Tim. Before we get to the books, I want to ask you about your athletics, your triathlete. How did you get into that? Well, I've fired before, that's not for the faint of heart, right. Well, I do what's called a sprint triathlon, which is a shorter distance and it's the you know, swimming, biking and running. But I was getting bored with just running.

16:46 I'd been a longtime runner, and I was also racking up not only a lot of miles, I was racking ap lot of injuries. And the triathlon allows you to really cross train and do different things, and you know, injure yourself in a different ways. The battle scars, right, you can show us. That's when I got in this one. Yeah, I'm sorry when when when you as you get older, there's fewer and fewer people in your age group that are doing it. But the people that are doing it are very competitive. So it's I'm not winning any awards, but it's still great to go out there and do something healthy and I feel like I'm competing against some really talented people. Funny, during COVID, I did a virtual five k, which means you run a five k, take a picture of your watch at the completion. It's an honor system, and I came in first in my age class. Turned out I was the only one in my.

17:37 Age That's okay, that's that's a that's a side note. That's right. I actually was pretty proud of myself. I did well for me, Tim, I neglected to ask you earlier. You'll notice it as we're talking at some point to put your website for the book books rather uh, and any contact info like an email address you may want to put put in the chat and want to put in the crawl. Okay, So I want to get back to the tie in. You know, when we were starting we you said that psychology is the sort of string that brings your counseling background, the business development work that you do, and the books together. Talk about that, and then I want to talk about how you became an author, when you realized you wanted to be an author, et cetera.

18:29 That's a great question. And I remember when I had my private practice, and this goes back several years, many years now, and I thought, I got to write this stuff down. I've got to I've got to write a book. And but the the individual people you know, for not not only for ethical reasons, but it wouldn't make a great book just talking about ky studies. So what I did is I wrote a story about people, and I in the first which is strike too, You're out here. It is strike too, You're out that. Yeah, there you go, you get a nice copy there. The main character in that becomes after college, it becomes a psychotherapist, psychologist, and so I was able to channel a lot of these stories through his clients. But there was no one, uh person, no one character in the book who represented one actual person. It's a real composite, as I did with all my characters. They don't represent any one particular person. But it was a way to kind of weave them in and show that real people have real problems. And I was able to, you know, express a lot of these a lot of some of them were very serious. But for the most part, a lot of people's issues are mundane to the rest of us, but they're important to the person who's going through it.

19:58 When did you know, actually, when did you start writing that? What year? So I published it in twenty nineteen, the first book, but it took me six years to write twenty thirteen. So I was in my mid fifties when I first started writing these things down. And my process was to walk the dogs in the morning and through the woods and come up with. All of this stuff. And I did a lot of traveling in those years, pre pandemic and I would get onto a plane. Instead of watching the TV and the seat back in front of me, I would take out a pad and I would just write and write, write the next thing I know it. We were planning at the destination, and very often that night I would take out my laptop and type up what I had written and get my first edit.

20:45 And so, did you have an editor? Did you have after a while get an editor? Who did you editing? So my wife happened to be a retired teacher, but she also had taught at the college level and taught English and that sort of thing, and felt with her literary background, she would really be good. So she did my first read and edit, which was, you know, the things in that book, it's not a happy book for her to read some of them. I give her a lot of credit for being able to read it and be critical as far as what I was writing.

21:29 Had she not heard a lot of probably many of those stories before. Right, Because of the nature of the business, you can't share that you know any particular stories about a particular person. But as a composite character and embellishing it, you know, that's the author's privilege to embellish, you know, then it was really the first time that she'd heard some of those stories, and I think to think that I was the one going through some of that was upsetting to her. I'm not surprised. I don't blame her. So when did you started writing? Did you know you wanted to be it to become a novel? Did you know you wanted to become a novelist? And then talk about also the process of getting it published.

22:17 Okay, so I didn't know. If I don't consider myself a writer, certainly didn't at that time, and I didn't know what it could become. I started writing it as a scene act one, scene one, as if it were a play or stage production or something like that, and I think it would lend itself to that. But as I kept going on and on. And creating new scenarios and new periods in the main character's life, it was getting onto number of pages. It's about three hundred and sixty pages or so, and so there was something, there was enough substance. The process of getting it published, I went through into an independent publishing process, which is KDP Kindle Direct Publishing. That's an Amazon product they had taken over. I can't even remember the name that it had before that. And I also sought the guidance in association through the Independent Publishers of New England, the I p n E. A lot of great people there and a lot of very helpful pointers from people who've done this many times.

23:29 So tell us tell the audiences, listeners and viewers about Joe Davis. So, Joe Davis is a guy that does a lot of bad things in his life, but I think you still root for him some of the things that happened to him. By the way, main character of stricture you're out man. Main main character he he gets to himself into some trouble as a young teenager, and one of the ways out of his trouble is to volunteer for Vietnam or volunteer for the Marine Corps. It just happened to be at the tail end of the Vietnam War. So some of the problems he brought on himself, and then the issues of going to Vietnam and witnessing what he did was thrust upon him. And he's someone that didn't do well resolving one issue before he got involved in the next issue. So the one issue beget another issue, and then another, and they never got resolved. He kept plowing through life, and I think even though he does some dastardly things, still rooting for him in a way, you just you want to get You want him to redeem himself. And I think that's what it is. And the title has nothing to do with baseball. Strike too, You're out. It's really has to do with life. Isn't necessarily fair. You don't always get three swings at the at bat. You might get called out after you've had two shots at it. And I think that's what the

25:01 theme through it is. Is that. You really should take care of your issues while you're here and you get a chance to do it, and don't be thinking always how can I get away with this until the next thing, till the next thing? Who's the book intended for? Definitely an adult audience. It's got some graphic content, it's got some graphic language, but it's intended for anyone who likes to read and who might not require a happy ending. So Joe doesn't have a happy I know I was going to mention that, I don't know if you would or not, but Joe does not have that happy of an ending. No, we won't say what the ending is thank you.

25:43 Yeah, it's funny, it's not. The book is not wasn't loved by everyone. In fact, this summer, my dad who actually just passed away a couple of months ago, but he was really with it right up until the end and to ninety eight years old. And this the summer he called me and he said he was so excited. He said, hey, I finished reading your new book, Sam Sora. I interrupted, I said, oh, what did you think of it? He says, well, it wasn't as bad as the first one. Thanks Bob. Yeah, so he someone who uses clean language, used clean language all the time, and this strike too, You're Out, has the liberal use of the F word. And it's just the way that the character spoke. I don't necessarily talk like that all the time, but.

26:34 No, I don't know. You did talk that way. Yeah, I felt like the character did, and it didn't. It wasn't gratuitous. It was just part of the character's life. And I think for someone who'd prefer not to see that, this might not be the book for them. And where's the book available? So it's available on Amazon. I think it's on Walmart dot com as well. The first one. Anyways, strike to You're Out. Our interrupted is only available through Amazon. I had I had both books available at different bookstores, but unfortunately bookstores are a tough business, and our local bookstore here in Plymouth, mass has recently gone out of business.

27:17 Thanks. Yeah, that really does think I listen. I'm an Amazon fan, as I think most people are, whether it's fan or a user. Uh, but it's it was really cool. It's really cool to go into a bookstore and browse and sit and read and flip pages. Yeah. I've made it available at several libraries too, but it's it's a thrill to just you know, it's an ego books to go into a library. And see your own book there. So it's kind of a whot. Have you done any promotion? Have you done any speaking readings or speaking or book events. I've done some when especially when the bookstore downtown was open, we did a reading down there and you know, a signing ceremony and that was really nice. I've also done some book groups and where book clubs people will buy the book, and now we were doing them virtually, so people will buy the book once they've all read it, and then we schedule a zoom call and uh, I'll go in and we can. I can do readings and and talk about the book, and they asked me a lot of questions. I've also I've also went back to my alma mater, Providence College, and spoke to the fiction writers seminar class and did a couple of readings for them and you know, answered their questions about the writing process.

28:37 And again, I never felt like I'm a writer. You know, when I read books, I read really good books, and I'm not I'm not hemingway okay, but uh yeah, yes, not not even that well. But apparently enough people like the book. Uh you know, I found a lot of great got a lot of great reviews from it, and so people do enjoy it. And I think the one things one person said to me that really stuck with me. We were playing in the band and I was promoting the book. The first one in that book, in Strike two You're Out, I had to write a song as a poem in the book, and then I said it to music and we played that in our band. So that kind of gave me excuse to sell the books.

29:31 But someone came up to me and afterwards said, hey, I read your book. And he said it really wanted to meet him. It really made me want to be a better person. Wow, that really floored me because I had no intention of you know, that was not my goal and it was just really so gratifying. So it's also award winning. Tell me about that process. Did you submit, did it come up or did you submit for an award? And how does that work? So it's really my work, you know, throughout my career the arts. You know, this was for the doctor Adrian Tinsley ward Is through the Bridgewater State University Alumni Association and every couple of years they award someone who's had achievements in the arts. And the first book was really kind of a culmination of all that. I mean, I had to write a song in the book. I had to write the book, and then we performed the song in my band, and you know, I think it was just seeing that I through my involvement with the arts through my career, that this was kind of the you know, the capstone, and so I was recognized for that.

30:38 That's very cool. Yeah, that's very cool. All right, we will take our second commercial. Everybody will be back in about sixty seconds with Tim Hassett, Sally. You're listening to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helene on W four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com. Don't go away. More helpful information is coming right up right here on Winning Business Radio. The yp dot com website is your local search engine. If you're looking for a good restaurant, it can help you find the right one nearby with ratings and reviews. Or if your car breaks down, you can use the YP app to find the closest repair shop. Or maybe you're just looking for something to do on a Friday night.

31:21 While it has great local coupons for all sorts of things in your area, no matter what, when or where. If you're looking for something, YP local search can help you find it. So go to YP dot com or download the app to search local, find local, and save local. And now back to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helene, presenting exciting topics and expert guests with one goal in mind to help you succeed in business. Here once again is Kevin Helena. So we're back with Tim Hasset Sally. He's two time award winning author of Strike to You're Out and Sam Sorrow Interrupted, which we'll get to in just a moment.

32:07 Here. He also happens to be the director of revenue Development at WCRI, that's Workers Compensation Research Institute. So tell us now about samsaraw interrupted and start with who is Samsara? So Samsara is the Buddhist notion of reincarnation, of birth, death and then rebirth. And so. This book is really about the afterlife, if you will. But it's a novel. I wrote a story around it, and I don't want to give away too much, except I will say that the main character is in a horrendous automobile accident, Peter Dunn, Peter Dunn, and he wakes up, if you will, and wonders if he's in heaven, if he's in hell, or slowly came to him that he might have been reincarnated. And so it's I think it's a notion that's fascinating to people. I think I've talked to other people who had this. You wonder what happens to us after we die? Of obviously most people think of that. And I kind of looked at the Judeo Christian tradition of the afterlife and kind of compared that to the Buddhist notion of reincarnation and I had the main character, Peter Dunn, kind of hedges bets because he wasn't sure where he was, yes in case, yes, in case, and he was like he had to go back and live life again as a teenager.

33:39 So in a way, that was kind of like hell. But you know, it's funny that there'd be some things I'd enjoy, some things I definitely wouldn't enjoy to do over again. Exactly exactly. And I think that's something that most adults, and I'll speak as an adult male, we all have this fantasy or what would it be like to go back and to be young again, but. To have the wisdom knowledge of the like Bob Seeger. Says, you know, the life of young man with the wisdom of an old man, and what would that be like? And so I've kind of played that fantasy out and you know, really talked about some life lessons in in that process. And it's it's a messy, complicated life, but a believable life that that the main character had.

34:28 And you know how it ends. I think most people have really enjoyed the ending, but they didn't see it coming. And yes, so I enjoy that it was the way I hope so it was kind of a double twist at the end. So the it was that was a lot of fun to write that book. There was less of me in that book than there was in the first novel, but you know, it's I got. I did set it back in Great Marx, Connecticut, which is the old original name of Ellington, Connecticut. So people who know me and from growing up who bought the book enjoyed the local references.

35:16 Cool. And where did the idea come from? And what was the process? I'm I I could be wrong. I'm guessing this was a shorter than six year process. Not much. It was took me four and a four and a half years to write this the idea. I actually had this idea before I had to strike to You're Out. The strike to You're Out was more emotional for me, and I felt like I had to get it out. But I think, I mean, my whole life, you wonder about the afterlife. And if you you say. In the beginning, you grew up in the Roman Catholic tradition, tradition, and you've you've learned about other other religions or worldviews. Yes, you're right, and I've studied various religions and and for this book in particular, I had to do considerable research into Buddhism, which was not my culture. So I wanted to use the aspects of it, especially as Americans understand Buddhism, which is not in its pure form. But I wanted to do it without cultural, you know, appropriation.

36:22 I wanted to do it as as an American would kind of take on a different religion that they weren't familiar with. And so I think I think I did it in a respectful way. But also I don't think I answered any major questions that people have. You're left with as many questions at the end of the book as you as you started with, except I think I pretty much put put the rest that notion that going back in time might be fun. I think it wouldn't be as much fun as we fantasize it to be. So I'm really curious about the cover fow which you took, Yes, really well done. Where did you find that image?

37:05 And I found that in my front flower bed. Uh. The Buddha statue had been up on a pedestal and it just you can tell it deteriorated over time. It fell off and it was just laying in a bed of leaves and I yeah, and I just happened to see it. And that angle of the of the picture was the exact angle of me just standing over it looking down at it. My son is a graphic artist and he designed the cover based on that photograph and I was really thrilled with the work he did in that. And I'll shout out to my daughter in law, Bridget Griffin, who did the first strike to your oute.

37:47 That's original to ask I forgot, Yeah, that's. Original artwork that she did. I had given her a stick figure representation of what I wanted to see and she came up with that in the color scheme and it was I was just thrilled with the word she did. That's awesome, it's really good. What part did your psychological background, your therapy background play in the second book, if any. Only a little? The main character Peter Dunn and his wife before the terrible accident. You know, he'd been married for a number of years and they had some real life struggles that they had gone through, and therapy was one of the vehicles that his wife had.

38:32 His wife was may. What she had gone through to try to overcome the problems that they'd had earlier in their life. But otherwise, I think my personal psychology training gave me insights into their personalities. But I didn't come out I didn't do it so directly as I did in the first book, where with making the character cologist. And was there a particular audience you had in mind for sorry interrupted. Anyone who's still alive or maybe having been reincarnated, I think will be enjoying the book.

39:15 Nice. Nice? Uh? Future future plans for additional books. Well, I just started writing what I think will be another book because it's it's mostly up here and I had but uh, I think there will be some substance there. And this is another kind of what if book. What if my life had taken a different direction, What if I had made different choices earlier on? Where would that have led out to? Yeah? Uh, Strike to your Oute was definitely definitely a what if book. You know, there's uh just right off the bed. I'll give away one thing and strike to uh.

39:58 His troubles began at the tobacco farm when he was picking tobacco and a migrant worker had stolen his lunch the first day he showed up on the job. In real life that happened to me, and I went to confront the worker and he was up an a tractor and he just pulled out a big long knife, which was my signal to back off. And it was also my signal to never again bring my lunch to work. It was just going to get stolen. So in the book, I have him bring a lunch the second day as well, and he leaves it in the same spot as where it had gotten stolen the first day. But on the second day he put broken glass and ground up free doos inside of his sandwich so that when whoever stole his sandwich were to eat it, we're going to get severely injured. And that's exactly what happened, and that's where he faced charges and was given the option of going to juvenile detention or going to the Marine Corps.

41:00 Wow. Okay, so you said the second book, First Books available on both around Amazon. First Books. On last I checked, it was still on Walmart dot com as well, but both are available on Amazon. I did leave my I have a website that I put in the chat for you during the break and yeah. It's gone across the kral a couple of times. Already it's oh Kim, Tim Hassett Sally, that's Tim. Well there it is right there, thanks one. So everyone should go to that website, Tim Hassett Dash Sally with an E y two s's and two t's and hass it and you will find some good information there. You'll get to know Tim a little bit more. You'll find the books, but you can find them on Amazon. All right, here's the question I like to end with. Who in the listening and viewing audiences should reach out to you and why?

41:54 Well, I'd be happy to talk to anyone who's read the book if they you want to think it's more insights. But as far as you know, as far as my career, I'm at the point of my career where I'm giving back nice yep and and uh, you know, younger people who are getting into development or sales, especially in my industry, I'm happy to talk to. I'm always glad to network. Networking is probably the single most important thing you can do, uh, and you're in to succeed, and so I'm always happy to do that. And if anyone had questions about the work we're doing at the w c RI, I I'm always happy to talk to them about that and see if there's a good fit between between our purposes.

42:41 Would you might be available, Would you be interested maybe in speaking about the book or the writing process. I know you speak a lot in your industry. What are some of the topics that you might talk about in terms of the book uh side, and then maybe some of the professional side. Probably everybody in that industry knows you already, but who knows. So on the on the professionals, we really talk about the types of research that we do and we do. We publish around forty reports a year, which is for the size of our staff, which is a remarkable accomplishment, but it's very well known. We are, you know, the really the organization in the industry that does that type of work. As far as the books, I'm just happy to talk to people to do a reading for a group, to do a signing, or to do to do a book club. And that's That's been a lot of fun, whether it's in person or I've been able to do it through Zoom throughout the pandemic with people from all over the country.

43:42 Yeah, that's pretty cool, Zoom. The good news of the pandemic was it opened up a lot of those relationships cross country, which you know, it's a good thing, that's the only good thing. But sure, I did notice. I meant to ask you. You did two stints at the current company you a while back, and somebody you enough to bring you back. I guess, well, I think that's true, Kevin, and I actually left there in twenty twenty during the pandemic. Yeah, and I was laid off. I don't think there's any secret there. And I was gone for almost three years, and about a year and a half, well almost two years ago, they brought me back. I'm thrilled to be back. It's a great organization.

44:24 I'm not planning to end my career any day soon, but it is the kind of place I'd love to finish my career. That's awesome. Love to hear that. And the best way again for people to get in touch with those on the radio, it's Tim Hassett Sally T I M h A S S E T T DASH s A L L E Y dot com. Timhassett Sally dot com. Tim, thank you so much for spending some time with us. My guess is the audience has enjoyed it. I certainly did it's good to reconnect. Oh, I will say this before we end. We've known each other for a long time, but we had this chance meeting which was fun and just unexpected, and you gave me the first book signed during the flight. We were on a flight together coming back from Orlando several months ago, you know, I think it's probably now six ish months ago, so random. Yeah, I know, we both them in Boston, but for us to be on the same play in the same city coming home from the same city, pretty funny.

45:18 One of those chance meetings that's really fun, and. That ended up us going back and forth a little bit and picking the right date for you to be on the air. So I appreciate it. Great catching up with you, Kevin, and I appreciate you having me on the program. My pleasure, and thanks everybody for watching and listening listening. This is the show about business, often business challenges. But if you've got concerns about the same effectiveness or the growth of your company, whether your sales team is you or very small or it's very large, feel free to reach out to me on Facebook or LinkedIn at Winning Business Radio. It's also Google my name Kevin Hallnyan or drop me a note at Kevin at Business Excuse me Kevin at Winning Business Radio dot com. Our company is Winning Incorporated. We're part of Sandler Training. We say we developed salespeople, sales teams into high achievers and sales leaders into true coaches and mentors. Hey listen, We're not right for everybody, but maybe we should have a conversation. Thank you to producer and engineer one. Thank you John One for another job well done. Really appreciate it. Be shared to join us next week, everybody, Monday, January twenty seventh, We'll do it all over again. Until then, this is Kevin helen In.

46:29 You have been listening to Winning Business Radio with your host Kevin Helena. If you missed any part of this episode, the podcast is available on Top four Podcasting and iHeartRadio. For more information and questions, go to the Winning Business Radio dot com or check us out on social media. Tune in again next week and every Monday at four pm Eastern Time to listen live to Winning Business Radio on W four CY Radio W fourcy dot com. Until then, let's succeed where others have failed and win in business with Kevin helen In and Winning Business Radio. H