Nov. 11, 2024

Matt Nettleton & Walker McKay - Accountability

Matt Nettleton & Walker McKay - Accountability

Walker McKay is the founder and principal of McKay Consulting Group, founder of No BS Sales and the No BS Podcast, and the author of Some Will, Some Won't, So What! Who's Next?

Matt Nettleton is President of Sandler DTB, and founder and host of...

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Walker McKay is the founder and principal of McKay Consulting Group, founder of No BS Sales and the No BS Podcast, and the author of Some Will, Some Won't, So What! Who's Next?

Matt Nettleton is President of Sandler DTB, and founder and host of Default Profitable Podcast.

Drawing from over 20 years as friends and colleagues, the three of us joined together to talk accountability. What does it look like? What is a good accountability partnership? How often should we connect? And more.

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WEBVTT

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The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are

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solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not

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those of W fourcy Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We

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Radio or it's employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments

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should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for

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choosing W four cy Radio.

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Churchill said, those who failed to learn from history are

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condemned to repeat it. Kevin Helen N believes that certainly

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applies to business. Welcome to Winning Business Radio here at

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W four cy Radio. That's W four cy dot com

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and now your host, Kevin Helen M.

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Thanks for joining in again today. I am Kevin Hallanan

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and welcome back to Winning Business TV and radio on

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W four cyd dot com. We're streaming live on talkfour

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tv dot com, and of course we're available on Facebook.

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We're streaming live that's at Winning Business Radio, and we

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are available in podcasts after the live show in pretty

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much whatever platform is your favorite for podcasts. That's YouTube

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by Heart, Radio, Spotify, Apple, and the list goes on

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the mission of winning business radio and TV. As regular

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viewers and listeners know, is to offer insights and advice

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to help people avoid the mistakes of others. That's to

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learn best practices, the how tos, the what tos, the

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what not tos, and I believe to be challenged and

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hopefully to be inspired by the successes of others. Those

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are consultants, coaches, advisors, authors, founders and owners, entrepreneurs, people

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with expertise. But you know, virtually every person, every successful

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person that I've ever had a chance to talk to,

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has had some form of failure in their lives and careers.

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So while we all have to get our knees skinned

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once in a while, I'm driven to keep those scrapes

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from needing major surgery. Let's endeavor to learn from history

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so we don't repeat it. I've spent the better part

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of my career equipping businesses to grow from solopreneurs to

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small and medium sized companies all the way up to

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the fortune fifty. I've seen some of those companies win,

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and to varying degrees, I've seen some fail. I've had

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the opportunity to rub elbows with some of the highest

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performing people around and with some who probably should have

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found other professions. In my own businesses, I've had lots

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of success, but of course some failures too, and I

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like to think I've learned a lot from those experiences.

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So you're going to hear from me my opinions and insights,

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but I'd rather you hear from others. Those are experts again,

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the consultants, coaches, business owners, advisors, authors, and today we

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have a treat at least in my opinion. Guys will

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let them decide afterwards if it was a treat or not.

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I have two guests, both longtime friends and colleagues, Walker

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McKay and Matt and Netleton. We the three of us

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met over twenty years ago while attending Sandler Conferences in Baltimore, Maryland.

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We attended those conferences about three times a year, often

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sitting on the same professional development workshops that were designed

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to equip us to better help our respective clients and

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of course to help them grow their businesses help us

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grow our businesses. We also began meeting together at the

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past of our bosses at the time with a smaller

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group of professionals within the Sandler Universe in a form

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of mastermind sessions. They actually called those good to Great sessions,

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and it was through those good to great sessions that

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the three of us realized the need for mutual accountability,

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and so we began meeting every Friday for a number

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of years. We'll get into that in a bit, but

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for now, here's more about Walker McKay and mattin Nettleton.

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After graduating from Washington and Lee University, Walker McKay began

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his professional journey in banking. He then transitioned to the

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commercial real estate industry, where he spent the next thirteen

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plus years honing his skills, business skills, and eventually owning

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his own agency. In two thousand and three, he realized

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you could make a career of helping other professionals develop

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their selling and business skills, and subsequently joined the Sandler

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Training Organization in Columbia, South Carolina, where he spent the

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next eleven and a half years, stepping away in twenty

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fourteen to start the McKay Consulting Group. Walker believes in

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the power of intentional transformation. After thirty five years of calling,

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networking and continually being referred to hundreds of clients in

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over twenty plus years, assisting companies in almost every industry

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to build world class sales teams. Walker has designed a

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sales system that will consistently close business without the client

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feeling like they're selling or the prospect feel like they've

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been sold. The system has been customized and personalized for

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thousands of clients and hundreds of industries. He's a lifelong salesperson,

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coach and creator of the no BS Sales School, where

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he teaches and shares has proven secrets to success for

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hitting targets, scoring revenue, and gaining the respect one deserves.

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Walker is the host of no BS Sales School podcast

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Again We're available wherever you can find your podcasts. There,

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He's there, and he recently published a book about sales.

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It's called Some Will Won't So What Who's Next? And

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it's available now in Amazon. We'll talk about that soon.

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Walker lives in Columbia, South Carolina with his wife of

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twenty five years. Her name is Sally, and they have

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two boys who love to fish and hunt. Matt Nettleton's

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journey has been shaped by two key key experiences. His

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football injuries and discovering his love for sales. The disciplines

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he honed on the football field help him thrive in

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is first and often regarded as one of the toughest

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sales roles, door to door vacuum cleaner sales. His natural

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talent led him to high ran ranking sales positions, including

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a role at Coca Cola, one of the large world's

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largest consumer brands, and later he took on the intense

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competition of residential real estate sales. In nineteen ninety nine,

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Matt joined Sandler Training as a client, where he found

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its structured approach aligned perfectly with his practical mindset, allowing

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him to guide others to sales success without relying on

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empty motivational slogans. Matt is all about pragmatism. Although his

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motto maybe show me the money, he emphasizes the importance

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of goals for growth. He says, to do the hard

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work of selling, my clients need to believe they can

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achieve their goals. He doesn't work with those satisfied with

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mediocrity or have a wage slave mentality. I love that,

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but rather by following the Sander method, Matt helps clients

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enjoy the sales process and achieve results. Faster. As the

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president of Sandler DTB, Matt applies the Sandler sales methodology

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to help clients significantly improve their revenue performance. Over his

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twenty plus year career, He's helped clients generate more than

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three point two billion in new revenue across industries like software, SaaS, staffing, agriculture,

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trades and entertainment. A Certified instructor with Sandler Training and

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certified with Extended disc and Caliber, Matt specializes in sales

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organization assessment, sales process development, and leadership leadership program excuse Me.

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Matt also hosts the Default Profitable podcast, interviewing successful small

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business owners and sharing insights on entrepreneurship. Matt's mission is

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to empower and inspire entrepreneurs to grow their businesses, their people,

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and themselves. Matt's married to his wife, Jessica, and they

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have three children and a poodle in Fishers, Indiana. Guys,

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welcome to winning business. That's all we have time for.

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Just kidding long.

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Haimes hot, Dang, that was a lot that.

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Was, but it's worth it. People need to understand kind

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of where you're coming from. So appreciate you guys being here.

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I know how busy you are. I want to start here.

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Though all of us grew up in sales, the three

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of us did, although in different industries. Take a minute

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each of you, Matt, why don't you go first, talk

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about how each of you got into sales as a career.

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So I grew up in Pransport, Pennsylvania. My dad ran warehouses,

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and so I got my first jobs were moving heavy

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things in warehouses. And because you know, big dumb guy,

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I can move heavy stuff, I'm good to go. Unfortunately,

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when I was playing college football, ruptured all ligments and

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tendons in both my thumbs nice and so I had

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to take a I had to have my thumbs fixed,

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and I was not allowed to lift anything over twenty

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five pounds for twelve weeks. When I said to the doctor,

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who's going to give me spending money for college? He said, listen,

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I'm fixing your thumbs. I don't know what you're asking

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me for. I'm like, well, I lift heavy stuff. That's

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how I make money. My parents aren't giving me any money,

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he said, I don't know. Look in the newspaper, and

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I answered a job that said good money, limited effort,

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and ended up selling vacuum cleaners. Door to door, limited effort,

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limited effort, which was great because I would worked eight

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hours a week perfect.

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I got in sales for all the wrong reasons I was.

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I was in college, I had lots of friends. I

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could drink beer with anybody. People were like, oh, you

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can talk to anybody, You've got lots of friends. You

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should go into sales. You're you're great. It can be

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natural of things, a natural which are as we all

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can laugh now, three of the absolute worst reasons to

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go into sales. And my success absolutely reflected that.

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So I was.

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I started in the banking business, a job that I

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was really not qualified for. I was a snot those

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kids from college, and all of a sudden, I was

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managing a branch somewhere with all these people who are

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older than me. And anyway it was I don't don't

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remember if I quit or got fired, but didn't last long.

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I went to the moved the commercial real estate business

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very quickly to go and make my fortune. And I

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remember the training that I got there was there's the desk,

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there's the street, those are buildings, go sell some. That

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was my That was my first year training, and the

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advanced training was you need to be the smartest guy

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in the room and the biggest asshole in the room.

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I was pretty good at being number too, not so

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good at being number one, and that really was a

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great advice. It didn't turn out any great advice for me,

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so I struggled along with that until I got some help.

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So the joke is, have you told your parents you're

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in sales yet? Right?

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No?

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No, I'm waiting for Thanksgiving at the end of the meal.

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So my story is, you guys have heard it. But

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I was in school for electrical engineering and my dad

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tapped me on the shoulder said hey, I need a

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sales guy. And my dad and I hadn't been close

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at the time, and I thought it was a great

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opportunity to spend more time with him, and it turned

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out that that turned out to be true. But he said,

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you know you're going to be a sales guy. Well,

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I didn't know anything about selling. I had done some things.

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I'd sold seeds door to door as a boy scout

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to make some money, and you know, at fundraising in

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school and things like that. I was pretty good at that,

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but I knew nothing about really selling. And living in

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Massachusetts turned out my territory was Maine, Vermont, and northern

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New he I'm sure, all right, Walker, you know Maine

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because you hunt there. But there aren't a lot of

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people in those I mean there are, but to you

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and I, to the rest of us that come from

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metro areas, there aren't a lot of people. So I

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would drive from one stop to the next. I'll get there,

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but I would drive from one stop to the next

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hour hour and a half between stops, and they were

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all cold calls. Now these were people that knew us,

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but we were trying to sell them to kind of

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come back in the industry. In that territory. There hadn't

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been somebody up there for a long time. We were selling

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foam products, anything soft that you could sit on or

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package things in. Fascinating business. But you know, his training

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was very similar. There's the phone, there's the car. He

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gave me his old car. Here's a card. But don't

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spend more than next dollars. You know, fill your tank

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whenever you need it. And I was just driving around

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and I was hitting these really small shops and not

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being very successful because my training was you know the same. Yeah,

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all right, take a second before we get into the

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meat here and talk about out how each of you

222
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got into sales training.

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Walker.

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So, I have a friend of mine. I was fishing

225
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with him one day and he said, I'm going he said,

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I hired a sales coach. I said, really, I said,

227
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why hell do you need a sales coach? You're great

228
00:12:16.799 --> 00:12:18.399
at sales, you know a ton of people, You've got

229
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lots of friends, you convinced people of stuff. Why don't

230
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we need sales training? He said, well, I really, I

231
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think I could do better. I was like, that's crazy,

232
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and I was sure that he'd gotten ripped off. And

233
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so I called a sales coach and said, I want

234
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to come talk to you. I said, my friend gave

235
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you money, and I think you ripped him off, and

236
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I want to come up a conversation. So my arrogant

237
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self went over to go sit down with him, and

238
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thirty minutes later, well he asked me. He said, you're

239
00:12:45.720 --> 00:12:47.240
in commercial real essays. He is that you must have

240
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make it at least a million dollars a year, and

241
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I'm like, no, no, no, and he said half a million.

242
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I'm like no, he said two fifty. And I said, well,

243
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I hope to this year and he said, why not

244
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a million? And I began to spew out these reasons.

245
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You know, Columbia, South Carolina had economy, this and the other.

246
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I look up and he's given me the stop side.

247
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I said what And he said, suppose I told you

248
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I thought all those were excuses. And I was like,

249
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oh shit, And he was right, and probably fifteen minutes

250
00:13:17.320 --> 00:13:19.360
later was crying as obviously what a loser I was.

251
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And I wrote him a check to hire me in

252
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the check or for me to hire him, and the

253
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check bounced, but he kept me anyway, So it was

254
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a It was quite a day, best day, best decision

255
00:13:30.120 --> 00:13:32.879
I made, really good, except for marrying my wife.

256
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Of course, well that's a given because she's listening.

257
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And I know that that's true. Honey, yours first.

258
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Matt Well, I did not marry Walker's wife, so I

259
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don't have that decision. Before that, I was selling residential

260
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real estate. I had been in the business for a

261
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couple of years. I was top two percent in the

262
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world for century twenty one and we had a kid,

263
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my wife and I had a kid, and I realized

264
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that the hours that I was working to be successful

265
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would result in my kid. Knowing that he had a father,

266
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unaware of what his father looked like or what his

267
00:14:12.919 --> 00:14:17.000
name was. You know, I was working a lot, a

268
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lot of hours early late evenings, weekends, and so I

269
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showed up to a I responded to an ad that

270
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was still one of my favorite ads of all time.

271
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It was our standards are high, it may be time

272
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to up yours, I love, and I called in. I

273
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had a conversation. The guy said, well, what do you

274
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actually want to accomplish? I said, well, I'd like to

275
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make the same money and work half as much. And

276
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he said, well, I'm not sure we can do that.

277
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I said, well, I'm willing to give it a try.

278
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Nobody else has the plan. And so a year later,

279
00:14:56.559 --> 00:14:59.679
as I sat back and reviewed my decision, I was

280
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actual fully disappointed to realize that I had worked half

281
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as much, didn't work any nicer weekends, which in residential

282
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real estate is fairly rare. But I had made one

283
00:15:09.840 --> 00:15:13.600
thousand dollars more. So I had screwed up and not

284
00:15:13.799 --> 00:15:16.879
hitting my goal, I had achieved more, out.

285
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Paced dang it, out paste, dang it amazing. How about you?

286
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All right, we're going to take our first break. It'll

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be about sixty seconds. We'll come back. I'll tell my story.

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We'll be back in just a minute with Matt Nettleton

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and Walker McKay.

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You're listening to Winning Business Radio with Kevin helenet on

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W four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com.

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Don't go away. More helpful information is coming right up

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right here on Winning Business Radio.

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00:15:53.120 --> 00:15:55.600
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00:15:58.960 --> 00:16:02.279
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00:16:06.519 --> 00:16:10.120
Call five six one five zero six four zero three

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00:16:10.120 --> 00:16:12.320
to one now to get booked on one of our shows.

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That's five six one five zero six four zero three

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00:16:16.440 --> 00:16:19.159
to one. Geg you're free advertising now.

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00:16:23.480 --> 00:16:26.519
And now back to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helene,

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00:16:26.519 --> 00:16:30.360
presenting exciting topics and expert guests with one goal in

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mind to help you succeed in business. Here once again

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is Kevin Helene.

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All right back with Matt Nettleton and Walker McKay. My

308
00:16:46.480 --> 00:16:51.399
story was I had been a recruiter working for a

309
00:16:51.480 --> 00:16:54.120
company that grew like a weed, went from the suburbs

310
00:16:54.360 --> 00:16:59.600
into downtown Boston and took up two floors of this building.

311
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There were thirty recruiters. Turned out, I was the number

312
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one recruiter. I was crushing it. I was doing training, non,

313
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I mean, it wasn't good training. It was training. It

314
00:17:07.079 --> 00:17:09.240
was good enough, but all I knew at the time,

315
00:17:11.079 --> 00:17:15.920
and I decided I wanted a management role. But there

316
00:17:15.960 --> 00:17:18.799
was no room in that company. They liked me, I

317
00:17:18.920 --> 00:17:20.720
liked them them. They didn't want me to leave. I

318
00:17:20.720 --> 00:17:22.759
didn't really want to leave, but I wanted a management role.

319
00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:27.279
So took another position in a boutique firm in the

320
00:17:27.319 --> 00:17:30.680
suburbs of Boston. My timing was terrible, though. It was

321
00:17:30.680 --> 00:17:33.799
about ten days before nine to eleven. So nine to eleven,

322
00:17:33.880 --> 00:17:36.720
you guys, remember, it was terrible. Nobody could sell anything,

323
00:17:36.720 --> 00:17:41.039
at least I couldn't. Nobody was traveling, nobody was using

324
00:17:41.480 --> 00:17:47.000
agencies to hire, and so that year one to two

325
00:17:47.119 --> 00:17:48.960
was the worst selling year of my career. I went

326
00:17:48.960 --> 00:17:51.359
from the top thinking, you know, making money, killing it,

327
00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:54.119
big guy, big man on campus too. I couldn't sell

328
00:17:54.119 --> 00:17:56.160
my way out of a wet paper bag. And I

329
00:17:56.200 --> 00:17:59.480
had a crisis of confidence. And I had been asking

330
00:17:59.519 --> 00:18:02.039
around and you know is it time for me to

331
00:18:02.039 --> 00:18:04.799
get professionally trained. And I'd met this woman who owned

332
00:18:04.839 --> 00:18:07.799
another recruiting agency, who actually had made me an offer,

333
00:18:07.839 --> 00:18:09.480
and I turned her down to take the one I took.

334
00:18:10.119 --> 00:18:12.480
In hindsight, I wish I had worked for her. I

335
00:18:12.559 --> 00:18:14.400
went back to her and said, how did you, you know,

336
00:18:14.440 --> 00:18:16.839
get as successful? You did some sales training, didn't you?

337
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And she referred me to to Sandler and the conversation

338
00:18:21.160 --> 00:18:25.359
of me being trained, the guy that hired me took.

339
00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:27.599
He sized me up pretty quickly. He saw a guy

340
00:18:27.640 --> 00:18:30.039
that had four kids in private school and needed to

341
00:18:30.039 --> 00:18:33.440
make money, so the conversation quickly went to, well, why

342
00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:35.240
don't you work for us? And you know that's the

343
00:18:35.279 --> 00:18:39.759
story never looked back. Be'st one of the best decisions professionally, absolutely,

344
00:18:39.960 --> 00:18:40.400
so you.

345
00:18:41.000 --> 00:18:42.960
Get training and they hired you instead.

346
00:18:43.160 --> 00:18:46.359
They did. They did that only because they saw a

347
00:18:46.400 --> 00:18:52.559
guy that was needy and had to succeed. Wasn't that bright? Exactly? Exactly?

348
00:18:52.640 --> 00:18:56.839
Fifth suit Johnny Bravo, All right, knowing what we all

349
00:18:56.880 --> 00:19:01.279
know now today about being real really professionally trended sellers,

350
00:19:01.480 --> 00:19:04.720
and in terms of how those professionally trends sellers sellers,

351
00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:07.920
you should behave and what should they should expect from

352
00:19:07.920 --> 00:19:11.359
the perspective clients. What's the biggest change that each of

353
00:19:11.400 --> 00:19:17.519
you made when you started to internalize what we now teach.

354
00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:23.680
God Matt, So, the biggest change that I made. So

355
00:19:24.279 --> 00:19:27.359
my first professional sales role, I was with Coca Cola USA,

356
00:19:28.039 --> 00:19:30.440
which is coking the cup, not coking the can. Those

357
00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:34.680
are two different, okays, okay, And we had ninety five

358
00:19:34.720 --> 00:19:38.480
percent market share of non pepsi owned restaurant business.

359
00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:41.119
Okay, just don't screw it up, right, So.

360
00:19:41.960 --> 00:19:43.680
Yeah, you're doing pretty well. If you got a ninety

361
00:19:43.680 --> 00:19:46.920
five percent share, there's a pretty buch doubt you're not.

362
00:19:47.160 --> 00:19:49.680
You're not getting that last five percent. There's like a reason.

363
00:19:50.519 --> 00:19:52.400
So I'd go into restaurants. I'll be talking to somebody

364
00:19:52.440 --> 00:19:54.559
that hey, you're using pepsi. They're like, yeah, well, I

365
00:19:54.599 --> 00:19:56.960
had a cousin that got through an astery divorce with

366
00:19:57.039 --> 00:19:59.839
this guy that lives in Cocomo and he's related to

367
00:19:59.880 --> 00:20:02.559
the bottler. And I'd never use you guys because of that.

368
00:20:03.160 --> 00:20:06.359
There's nothing I can do with that. So I had

369
00:20:06.400 --> 00:20:08.960
a mindset when I got out of working for Coke

370
00:20:09.880 --> 00:20:14.319
that the market was fairly finite and that it was

371
00:20:14.519 --> 00:20:19.559
hard to take business from other people. And the single

372
00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:23.200
biggest mindset shift that I've had since I became a

373
00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:28.039
Sandler trainer was the realization that there are more businesses

374
00:20:28.079 --> 00:20:30.599
within one mile of the front door of my office

375
00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:33.799
than I could serve in a lifetime. And in fact,

376
00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:36.880
in Indianapolis, you know, in the three one seven area code,

377
00:20:37.440 --> 00:20:42.440
there are twenty four thousand employee id numbers who have

378
00:20:42.559 --> 00:20:45.640
reported revenue of two to fifty million dollars, which is

379
00:20:45.640 --> 00:20:49.279
my primary more. I'm pretty sure I can't service twenty

380
00:20:49.279 --> 00:20:53.279
four thousand businesses. Wow, So Walker.

381
00:20:55.200 --> 00:20:59.400
Mine, I kind of referenced it when I described how

382
00:20:59.400 --> 00:21:02.839
I found sales training. My biggest revelation was the excuses

383
00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:05.240
that I was making. You know, I've been saying it

384
00:21:05.279 --> 00:21:07.039
for so long. The people around me been saying things

385
00:21:07.079 --> 00:21:10.119
for so long, like, you know, the economy sucks, or

386
00:21:10.160 --> 00:21:13.359
those clients an asshole, or this is a problem, or

387
00:21:13.799 --> 00:21:16.559
you know, nobody's buying this, or we might as well

388
00:21:16.599 --> 00:21:21.559
not even try. And and once I began to recognize

389
00:21:21.599 --> 00:21:23.400
and it's very obvious when I say them now, but

390
00:21:23.400 --> 00:21:25.680
at the time is what everybody around me was saying too,

391
00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:27.759
and nobody actually had the courage to call me out

392
00:21:27.759 --> 00:21:32.559
on it. So when all of a sudden, when all

393
00:21:32.559 --> 00:21:37.000
of a sudden my coach said that you're making excuses,

394
00:21:37.039 --> 00:21:39.640
all of a sudden, I became hyper aware, and so

395
00:21:40.000 --> 00:21:44.960
I've started to replaced my language of they won't, it'll never,

396
00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:48.440
it's impossible to with I haven't figured out how to yet,

397
00:21:49.319 --> 00:21:51.799
figured out a million dollars's physiness, but I hadn't figured

398
00:21:51.799 --> 00:21:53.200
out how to get that guy to call me back.

399
00:21:53.240 --> 00:21:55.000
I hadn't figured out how to make this work. And

400
00:21:55.480 --> 00:21:58.000
I've found this wild be the most empowering words I've

401
00:21:58.000 --> 00:22:01.279
ever had and has helped me a lot of the

402
00:22:01.319 --> 00:22:02.799
issues that I bring.

403
00:22:02.599 --> 00:22:09.079
To the damn Yeah, mind's similar. I'm sorry, go ahead finish.

404
00:22:09.119 --> 00:22:11.880
So I believe that when you say something like I

405
00:22:11.920 --> 00:22:14.599
can't it'll never, they'll never, your brain goes, yeah, that's it.

406
00:22:14.880 --> 00:22:16.640
But when you say I hadn't figured out how to yet,

407
00:22:16.640 --> 00:22:18.559
your brain goes, yeah, we haven't figured that out yet.

408
00:22:18.559 --> 00:22:20.960
It kind of begins to work in the back. Maybe

409
00:22:21.680 --> 00:22:22.119
how about you?

410
00:22:22.640 --> 00:22:25.920
Yeah, mind similar. It's abundance versus scarcity mat as you

411
00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:29.640
just referred to the number of organizations that are targets

412
00:22:29.680 --> 00:22:32.960
are infinite. Right, and we couldn't possibly service them if

413
00:22:33.000 --> 00:22:36.519
we close them, so, you know, versus there's nobody. You know,

414
00:22:36.559 --> 00:22:38.880
they don't hire us, they don't use sales training. They're

415
00:22:38.920 --> 00:22:41.680
too big, they're too small. They probably have somebody on board.

416
00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:43.519
It's all the pre qualifying we do. But the other

417
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:47.319
part of it was from a practical perspective is knowing

418
00:22:47.440 --> 00:22:52.440
why you win and knowing why you lose and learning

419
00:22:52.440 --> 00:22:54.960
to change behavior. Right, keep doing the stuff you win at,

420
00:22:55.119 --> 00:22:57.079
stop doing the stuff you lose at. That was big

421
00:22:57.119 --> 00:23:04.759
for me. All right, let's see, So, Matt, you you

422
00:23:04.880 --> 00:23:07.119
floated the idea to Walker and me recently that we

423
00:23:07.119 --> 00:23:11.000
should have a conversation about accountability and recording, and I said,

424
00:23:11.279 --> 00:23:13.880
let's go one more, let's do a live show. It'll

425
00:23:13.880 --> 00:23:17.440
be recorded anyway. What was behind that idea?

426
00:23:18.720 --> 00:23:22.440
So I think the the idea of the live show,

427
00:23:22.559 --> 00:23:25.240
or the idea of the conversation around accountability came from

428
00:23:25.279 --> 00:23:28.920
your interview of Walker, and I think the you know,

429
00:23:29.480 --> 00:23:31.839
if we go back to twenty twenty three when we

430
00:23:31.880 --> 00:23:37.480
met was in June. We were in a business with

431
00:23:37.559 --> 00:23:39.319
an exceptionally high failure rate.

432
00:23:39.599 --> 00:23:44.920
Yeah, yeah, two thousand and three, Yeah, two thousand and three,

433
00:23:45.319 --> 00:23:47.079
although it's still a high failed business.

434
00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:52.640
But yes, still high failure business. Yeah. And you know,

435
00:23:53.319 --> 00:23:56.160
I when we were coming to the conference, I had

436
00:23:56.160 --> 00:23:59.599
been given some advice about, you know, put together a

437
00:23:59.640 --> 00:24:01.240
list all all the things you want to do and

438
00:24:01.480 --> 00:24:03.039
all the things you're going to change. You're gonna have

439
00:24:03.079 --> 00:24:07.720
three lists. And then one person just kind of casually

440
00:24:07.759 --> 00:24:09.880
threw it and oh, yeah, by the way, find somebody

441
00:24:09.920 --> 00:24:13.160
else trying to accomplish what you're trying to accomplish, and

442
00:24:13.200 --> 00:24:16.920
stay in touch with them because they'll help you. And

443
00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:18.799
as it turns out, the first half of that advice

444
00:24:18.880 --> 00:24:21.480
was complete bold, but the second half of that advice

445
00:24:21.599 --> 00:24:26.640
was incredibly valuable. And you know that led to our

446
00:24:27.079 --> 00:24:29.480
Friday phone calls for probably two years.

447
00:24:29.640 --> 00:24:30.240
Yeah.

448
00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:32.480
I don't know that we missed very many of them. No,

449
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:35.200
I don't know that we missed any of them. But

450
00:24:35.319 --> 00:24:40.599
those Friday phone calls were a great kind of a

451
00:24:40.640 --> 00:24:44.720
clarifier of what it was that I needed to do

452
00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:48.000
in order to succeed and remain in the business that

453
00:24:48.039 --> 00:24:50.839
I had chosen to be in excellent.

454
00:24:51.000 --> 00:24:52.160
I mean, we're going to get in the weeds of

455
00:24:52.200 --> 00:24:53.839
it in just a minute here, but I remember one

456
00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:55.680
of us said Matt, I might have been you. I

457
00:24:55.680 --> 00:24:58.160
don't know, but somebody said, I'm not sure this is working.

458
00:24:58.240 --> 00:25:00.839
I feel like I'm taking more out of these calls

459
00:25:00.839 --> 00:25:02.799
that I'm giving. And it turned out we all felt

460
00:25:02.799 --> 00:25:05.880
that way, Yes, right, that that was huge.

461
00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:08.599
Yeah, we all felt like the other two were doing

462
00:25:08.599 --> 00:25:11.960
more lifting than we were. Yeah, which was cool, and

463
00:25:12.039 --> 00:25:14.559
at some times it was you know, at each point

464
00:25:14.640 --> 00:25:16.599
one of us was anyway, it's all cool.

465
00:25:16.680 --> 00:25:19.599
Yeah, yeah, we all Yeah, one would be doing really

466
00:25:19.599 --> 00:25:21.400
well and the two would be doing well, one would

467
00:25:21.400 --> 00:25:23.640
be struggling with something, and you know, it would just

468
00:25:23.720 --> 00:25:25.839
keep going around like that. And I believe that was

469
00:25:25.880 --> 00:25:28.119
a turning point for the three of us. So just

470
00:25:28.119 --> 00:25:30.680
for context, that good to great group. You know, we

471
00:25:30.680 --> 00:25:33.279
were we were encouraged to get together, but we met

472
00:25:33.279 --> 00:25:34.960
each other and we started hanging out and we'd go

473
00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:37.640
out to dinner together and with in groups, but you know,

474
00:25:37.680 --> 00:25:40.519
we'd share our successes and failures, and then we started

475
00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:43.480
to formalize it. And I want people to hear about what,

476
00:25:43.839 --> 00:25:46.759
you know, what those calls sounded like. Uh, I know,

477
00:25:46.799 --> 00:25:49.759
we call them our accountability calls. And Matt, what would

478
00:25:49.759 --> 00:25:52.079
we what would we actually do on those calls.

479
00:25:53.680 --> 00:25:56.119
I'm not sure who came up with a format, although

480
00:25:56.160 --> 00:25:57.759
I think it might have been me. It might have

481
00:25:57.839 --> 00:25:59.680
been Walker, it might have been It didn't really matter

482
00:25:59.720 --> 00:26:03.079
in the end. But what we agreed was that we

483
00:26:03.079 --> 00:26:05.720
would each we would have a thirty minute call that

484
00:26:05.799 --> 00:26:07.680
would be at the same time every week, and it

485
00:26:08.160 --> 00:26:12.640
was a no negotiation, you do not miss, and that

486
00:26:12.680 --> 00:26:15.240
we would each take ten minutes five minutes to talk

487
00:26:15.279 --> 00:26:17.960
about something that we had done that was we thought

488
00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:20.279
went well, and five minutes to talk about something we

489
00:26:20.319 --> 00:26:23.680
thought we screwed up, and we would just go around

490
00:26:23.680 --> 00:26:27.480
the horn, and while you were talking, the other two

491
00:26:27.519 --> 00:26:31.039
people had the opportunity to jump in and give you

492
00:26:31.119 --> 00:26:34.039
feedback and opinions on what it was you were talking about,

493
00:26:34.200 --> 00:26:36.640
whether or not you wanted them.

494
00:26:36.240 --> 00:26:40.640
Whether or not you wanted them. That's good, wanted a lot.

495
00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:43.680
I just didn't want the opinions. It was already I

496
00:26:43.720 --> 00:26:45.799
had already figured out that I stucked. I didn't need

497
00:26:46.160 --> 00:26:46.880
to confirm.

498
00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:48.039
You're right, you do stink.

499
00:26:48.920 --> 00:26:52.519
I remembered it being some format of share a lesson

500
00:26:52.559 --> 00:26:55.559
we've learned, share a victory that we had, and what's

501
00:26:55.559 --> 00:26:57.319
something you're working on you wanted by someone.

502
00:26:57.519 --> 00:27:01.039
Right, So that's what happens that And that's the catchphrase

503
00:27:01.079 --> 00:27:03.759
that came out of that. Right, we all have these

504
00:27:03.799 --> 00:27:07.440
catchphrases in one liners. Uh but yeah, that's I think

505
00:27:07.480 --> 00:27:12.759
we're saying the same thing. All right, let's let's define accountability.

506
00:27:12.759 --> 00:27:14.640
How would each of you define accountability?

507
00:27:15.960 --> 00:27:21.200
Walker, It's basically saying out loud what you're gonna do,

508
00:27:21.559 --> 00:27:24.480
and then have the and I think the only person

509
00:27:24.519 --> 00:27:28.319
who can holds you accountable is yourself. But we in

510
00:27:28.440 --> 00:27:31.160
our group of well, quit of that. The only person

511
00:27:31.160 --> 00:27:33.960
who holds is self capable is yourself. Right. But you

512
00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:36.839
say out loud something that you're gonna do, and the

513
00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:42.839
other people in the group offered support. Be that be

514
00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:47.640
that negative support, which time as y'all say, screw you

515
00:27:47.839 --> 00:27:51.240
out of the group, you big user, or you know,

516
00:27:51.440 --> 00:27:52.799
or say way to go. You did what you said

517
00:27:52.799 --> 00:27:53.240
you're gonna do.

518
00:27:53.720 --> 00:27:59.000
Love, love you like a brother what you did to me? Right, Yeah,

519
00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:04.160
it's being accountable. It's being being responsible for our actions. Right,

520
00:28:04.200 --> 00:28:06.599
we say it, we're going to do it. And we

521
00:28:06.680 --> 00:28:10.519
had a good partnership because you know, we have different personalities.

522
00:28:10.519 --> 00:28:12.599
We're similar in some ways, but we're very different in

523
00:28:12.680 --> 00:28:16.720
other ways. You know, I'm not tall and you guys

524
00:28:16.720 --> 00:28:23.680
are smart. But it was a good chemistry and it worked.

525
00:28:23.720 --> 00:28:27.519
You know, we were honest, we were trustworthy, we cared

526
00:28:27.519 --> 00:28:29.559
about each other. I think that's a big ingredient. So

527
00:28:30.079 --> 00:28:36.400
who do we think needs accountability? I mean, lots of

528
00:28:36.400 --> 00:28:39.160
people watching this, lots of people listening, and even more

529
00:28:39.200 --> 00:28:42.480
will watch and listen later, right, So who needs.

530
00:28:43.400 --> 00:28:45.799
Anybody that wants to grow in something? I mean, whether

531
00:28:45.839 --> 00:28:49.000
you're an athlete or whether you're just want to get stronger,

532
00:28:49.160 --> 00:28:52.440
or your business and your ambitious and you just need

533
00:28:52.799 --> 00:28:57.319
the outside feedback and the you know, being a you know,

534
00:28:57.359 --> 00:28:59.319
the big part of the accountability to me was the

535
00:28:59.319 --> 00:29:02.519
accountability to the group, right, And that was the that

536
00:29:02.680 --> 00:29:05.640
was the part that was the big stake for me.

537
00:29:05.839 --> 00:29:09.880
We didn't want to just yeah.

538
00:29:10.279 --> 00:29:11.759
I think one of the things we did very well

539
00:29:11.799 --> 00:29:13.039
too was have three people.

540
00:29:14.000 --> 00:29:15.680
Yeah, Matt, you had a good phrase for that.

541
00:29:16.960 --> 00:29:17.640
What was it, Matt?

542
00:29:19.319 --> 00:29:21.240
What was it the phrase? I don't remember the phrase,

543
00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:24.960
but I know that the I know the thing with

544
00:29:25.000 --> 00:29:29.759
the three people that really made it work was it's

545
00:29:29.759 --> 00:29:33.880
an It's it's easy to fool one person at a time.

546
00:29:34.759 --> 00:29:38.319
It was very difficult to full two people. Yeah, And

547
00:29:38.640 --> 00:29:41.480
to the question of who needs accountability, I I have

548
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:46.279
yet to find any situation where and what it was told.

549
00:29:46.680 --> 00:29:48.759
I was told I needed to find a swim buddy.

550
00:29:50.200 --> 00:29:52.240
I needed to find somebody that was going through what

551
00:29:52.279 --> 00:29:55.519
I was going through and was and would drag me

552
00:29:55.599 --> 00:30:01.000
along with them. And and as I talk to people,

553
00:30:01.279 --> 00:30:04.160
it was made clear to me that three is better

554
00:30:04.200 --> 00:30:07.599
than two and four is too many. So you can

555
00:30:08.079 --> 00:30:11.720
have a one to one accountability relationship, you can have

556
00:30:12.519 --> 00:30:17.720
a three person accountability relationship, but in the words of

557
00:30:17.759 --> 00:30:19.640
the guy that explained this to me, you cannot have

558
00:30:19.720 --> 00:30:23.319
a four person accountability group. It's nice and you can

559
00:30:23.359 --> 00:30:25.960
have a nice conversation, but you are not going to

560
00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:29.839
generate meaningful accountability having four people involved in.

561
00:30:29.839 --> 00:30:32.160
A conversation that is interesting.

562
00:30:33.039 --> 00:30:37.079
So I would say anybody that is trying to accomplish

563
00:30:37.079 --> 00:30:41.319
something can use an accountability group not to learn things,

564
00:30:41.359 --> 00:30:45.680
but to make sure that they're applying what they've learned. Right, So,

565
00:30:45.720 --> 00:30:48.480
if you're in you know, I think we're all familiar

566
00:30:48.480 --> 00:30:52.119
with vistage and Vista style groups. Or you have a

567
00:30:52.160 --> 00:30:54.400
group of people that get together and learn something, well,

568
00:30:54.799 --> 00:30:57.359
when those guys leave, those groups. One of the things

569
00:30:57.400 --> 00:31:00.240
I know is the most effective groups that I've worked with,

570
00:31:01.039 --> 00:31:04.079
they'll have two or three owners that get together afterwards

571
00:31:04.759 --> 00:31:07.960
in some small subgroups and talk about how they're improving

572
00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:11.839
and what they're doing differently. And it's just you know,

573
00:31:12.160 --> 00:31:14.920
my son when he was doing high school sports and

574
00:31:14.960 --> 00:31:17.839
college sports, he had two guys that they agreed they

575
00:31:17.839 --> 00:31:20.359
were going to work out. It's easy for one guy

576
00:31:20.359 --> 00:31:22.200
to convince the other guy they don't want to work out.

577
00:31:22.559 --> 00:31:27.000
It's hard for all three people to take a day off. Well.

578
00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:30.279
Also, if you only have two and pretend you're running right,

579
00:31:30.359 --> 00:31:32.000
you're supposed to meet somebody in the morning, and one

580
00:31:32.000 --> 00:31:34.640
person doesn't show up, you really are screwing. Then the

581
00:31:34.640 --> 00:31:36.799
other person is let down. But if you have three

582
00:31:36.960 --> 00:31:40.160
and one doesn't show up, another two can continue to perform.

583
00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:42.079
And leave you behind and replace you.

584
00:31:42.720 --> 00:31:46.640
Yes necessary, Hey, we're going to take our second break.

585
00:31:47.319 --> 00:31:50.559
We'll be back everybody with Matt Nettleton and Walker McKay.

586
00:31:50.680 --> 00:31:54.880
In sixty seconds.

587
00:31:56.039 --> 00:32:00.480
You're listening to Winning Business Radio with Kevin helenet W

588
00:32:00.640 --> 00:32:04.640
four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com. Don't

589
00:32:04.640 --> 00:32:07.799
go away. More helpful information is coming right up right here.

590
00:32:07.880 --> 00:32:13.480
On Winning Business Radio. The yp dot com website is

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601
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602
00:32:47.880 --> 00:32:51.680
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603
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:55.440
one goal in mind to help you succeed in business.

604
00:32:55.599 --> 00:32:57.599
Here once again is Kevin Helena.

605
00:33:05.200 --> 00:33:07.920
All right, we're back with Walker and Matt. Matt, you

606
00:33:08.000 --> 00:33:10.039
mentioned something I thought was great. I wrote it down.

607
00:33:10.400 --> 00:33:12.240
We need a partner, not a policeman. What do you

608
00:33:12.240 --> 00:33:12.640
mean by that?

609
00:33:14.440 --> 00:33:18.119
Yeah, So accountability is not something that you do to somebody,

610
00:33:19.839 --> 00:33:23.119
it's something you do with somebody. I think, right, we

611
00:33:23.200 --> 00:33:28.119
never we never had like punishments. Nobody got no gies

612
00:33:28.200 --> 00:33:31.119
for not making their cold calls or I mean, it

613
00:33:31.200 --> 00:33:33.519
was hey, listen, this is what I'm going to do,

614
00:33:33.920 --> 00:33:36.200
and then next week it was hey, last week you

615
00:33:36.200 --> 00:33:37.680
said you were going to do this, did you do it?

616
00:33:38.519 --> 00:33:42.599
And if you didn't do it, you were embarrassed and

617
00:33:42.640 --> 00:33:45.200
nobody was going to let it slide. But there were

618
00:33:45.240 --> 00:33:48.039
no physical like trials.

619
00:33:47.599 --> 00:33:51.920
Or no no fines. Yeah yeah, no public flocks.

620
00:33:51.640 --> 00:33:55.000
Because that was imposed upon yourself. Yes, that was what

621
00:33:55.119 --> 00:33:58.160
happened to you because of not doing the work. That

622
00:33:58.240 --> 00:33:59.599
was going to happen to yourself. Right.

623
00:34:00.200 --> 00:34:04.519
Well, the problem with no accountability is it's easy to

624
00:34:04.599 --> 00:34:08.119
rationalize all the reasons you didn't do the work, right

625
00:34:08.920 --> 00:34:11.639
when you call it your accountability group, and the first

626
00:34:11.679 --> 00:34:14.199
person that talk says, well, here's what I did.

627
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:16.519
Yeah, and you're like.

628
00:34:16.480 --> 00:34:18.239
Well, Dan, that's what he said he was going to do.

629
00:34:19.000 --> 00:34:20.559
And now when I go, I got to say I

630
00:34:20.599 --> 00:34:22.159
didn't do what I said I was going to do.

631
00:34:23.159 --> 00:34:25.320
Maybe they'll forget me this week.

632
00:34:26.480 --> 00:34:27.800
Maybe they'll run out of time.

633
00:34:30.840 --> 00:34:34.679
Right, But that didn't always happen. I don't remember it

634
00:34:34.679 --> 00:34:35.360
ever happening.

635
00:34:37.400 --> 00:34:39.719
Always got five more minutes for the last guy.

636
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:43.480
So that's the that's the thing you know if you're

637
00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:50.119
I think with accountability, you can't be looking for external motivation,

638
00:34:50.440 --> 00:34:55.960
external punishment. With accountability, you have to have internal intrinsic

639
00:34:56.280 --> 00:35:00.519
motivation and you're just confirming what's going going on, and

640
00:35:00.559 --> 00:35:04.159
you got to find people that also have internal intrinsic motivation.

641
00:35:04.760 --> 00:35:07.199
You know, we've been around a long time. We've seen

642
00:35:07.199 --> 00:35:09.760
a lot of these accountability groups fail miserably.

643
00:35:10.119 --> 00:35:15.000
Yeah, yeah, all right, what about frequency? How often should

644
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:17.880
people talk? We chose weekly worked really well for us,

645
00:35:17.880 --> 00:35:21.119
I think Walker, I.

646
00:35:21.039 --> 00:35:23.920
Don't know that it matters. It probably depends upon what

647
00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:26.480
your goals are. I think weekly for salespeople is probably

648
00:35:26.519 --> 00:35:30.039
a good thing. Sometimes for business owners it could if

649
00:35:30.079 --> 00:35:32.280
you're having that kind of same thing, maybe it's once

650
00:35:32.320 --> 00:35:34.880
a month or once a quarter. I think it depends

651
00:35:34.920 --> 00:35:37.519
upon We were talking about behavior, right, how many dials

652
00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:39.199
and how many meetings and sales calls and that kind

653
00:35:39.199 --> 00:35:39.719
of stuff.

654
00:35:39.559 --> 00:35:42.760
When we were looking to close business like weekly, monthly

655
00:35:42.840 --> 00:35:44.599
Yeah at the mental right, Yeah, But.

656
00:35:44.480 --> 00:35:47.840
If you're running a business and you've got you know,

657
00:35:47.960 --> 00:35:50.920
longer term goals, then maybe quarterly is enough, or twice

658
00:35:50.920 --> 00:35:52.880
a year. I think it's it depends upon what you're

659
00:35:52.880 --> 00:35:54.920
trying to do longer term goals, you can have more

660
00:35:54.920 --> 00:35:59.400
time in between the meeting thoughts Matt or Matt Kevin thoughts.

661
00:36:00.039 --> 00:36:02.679
I was just going to say, what about content should be?

662
00:36:02.760 --> 00:36:06.119
I mean, methodology, is it phone, is it zoom? Is

663
00:36:06.159 --> 00:36:08.639
it in person? That probably depends back.

664
00:36:08.519 --> 00:36:14.079
Up to frequency. Yeah, because I really think that for

665
00:36:14.239 --> 00:36:21.239
most people, having a weekly conversation of fifteen minutes is

666
00:36:21.800 --> 00:36:26.559
you know, fifteen to thirty minutes max. Is something that

667
00:36:26.599 --> 00:36:30.119
they have to be willing to commit to. And the

668
00:36:30.159 --> 00:36:34.119
reason is we all over overthink what we can accomplish

669
00:36:34.119 --> 00:36:38.239
in twelve months, underthink what we can accomplish in one week. Yeah,

670
00:36:38.920 --> 00:36:41.800
And so you know a lot of the people that

671
00:36:41.880 --> 00:36:45.400
lose sight of their goals because it listen, everybody knows

672
00:36:45.480 --> 00:36:48.559
it's a ritual. You set goals the last week of December,

673
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:51.760
you fail on your goals, the second week of February,

674
00:36:52.280 --> 00:36:54.280
you ignore your goals by the first week of March.

675
00:36:54.360 --> 00:36:56.679
I mean, it's just that's them as well.

676
00:36:56.519 --> 00:37:00.679
Be written in stone. But if you could say, hey, listen,

677
00:37:00.719 --> 00:37:03.679
I know I have my annual goal, but here's what

678
00:37:03.719 --> 00:37:05.320
I think I can accomplish by the end of the

679
00:37:05.320 --> 00:37:08.400
first quarter. And here's what I'm going to do this week,

680
00:37:09.159 --> 00:37:12.719
and when we talk next week, here's what I'll commit

681
00:37:12.800 --> 00:37:16.679
to having done. Right. It doesn't matter if you run

682
00:37:16.719 --> 00:37:20.280
in a warehouse, or you're an accountant, or you're a

683
00:37:20.320 --> 00:37:27.360
salesperson or you're just working out. Like the frequency that

684
00:37:27.400 --> 00:37:30.760
you talk confirms the amount of time that you can

685
00:37:30.800 --> 00:37:31.519
go off track.

686
00:37:32.039 --> 00:37:34.159
That's good. That's really good.

687
00:37:34.599 --> 00:37:35.400
Yeah, that's what you said.

688
00:37:36.320 --> 00:37:38.920
That's why you're on this call, Matt. I appreciate that's

689
00:37:39.519 --> 00:37:41.159
right there. That appreciate you guys in.

690
00:37:41.199 --> 00:37:46.880
Witing me out of our accountability group.

691
00:37:47.039 --> 00:37:49.920
Funny, I feel like Matt. I'm learning so much from

692
00:37:49.920 --> 00:37:55.400
Matt today. I'm the one that's sucking asks. All right.

693
00:37:55.440 --> 00:37:57.199
So does it matter if it's a phone call, a

694
00:37:57.280 --> 00:37:59.320
coffee uh, you know, zoom call?

695
00:38:01.360 --> 00:38:03.519
I don't think so. I think face to face is good,

696
00:38:03.559 --> 00:38:05.559
which is why I like zoom. If I have a

697
00:38:05.559 --> 00:38:08.519
preference with zoom or face to face zoom for a

698
00:38:08.679 --> 00:38:12.400
time save, I like that better. But I don't know

699
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:13.960
that it matters in something.

700
00:38:14.920 --> 00:38:18.760
Whatever works, all right, Matt, you just talked about goals Walker.

701
00:38:18.840 --> 00:38:20.239
How important are goals?

702
00:38:22.880 --> 00:38:25.239
I guess it depends on how important, how much you

703
00:38:25.320 --> 00:38:28.199
value your time and what's your where you're trying to go?

704
00:38:28.400 --> 00:38:29.000
I think that.

705
00:38:31.840 --> 00:38:32.000
You know.

706
00:38:33.280 --> 00:38:35.599
Well, the thing about goals, right is what do you

707
00:38:35.639 --> 00:38:39.639
want to accomplish? And and the important thing I think

708
00:38:39.679 --> 00:38:41.960
we'd all agree is that they've got to be written

709
00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:45.880
down meaningful. I mean, there's the old smart goals thing.

710
00:38:45.920 --> 00:38:47.559
I keep trying to come up with something better than

711
00:38:47.559 --> 00:38:48.400
smart goals, but.

712
00:38:48.599 --> 00:38:50.599
I hate smart goals.

713
00:38:50.599 --> 00:38:52.159
Smart goals, I can hate them.

714
00:38:52.199 --> 00:38:57.920
So how about you do what you got? So it

715
00:38:57.960 --> 00:39:00.960
has to be something that's directly in your control, directly,

716
00:39:02.440 --> 00:39:08.679
it's got to be uniquely described by you. You got

717
00:39:08.719 --> 00:39:13.079
to be able to measure it, you got to be

718
00:39:13.079 --> 00:39:17.199
able to manage it. It has to be attached to

719
00:39:17.280 --> 00:39:18.320
a burning desire.

720
00:39:19.760 --> 00:39:23.719
This is so good and I love it because even

721
00:39:23.760 --> 00:39:32.880
spelled dumb wrong, that's awesome. Smart enough to spell dumb

722
00:39:32.920 --> 00:39:35.760
wrong and that's freaking I love.

723
00:39:35.559 --> 00:39:38.159
That all right? So why don't I just tell Matt

724
00:39:38.159 --> 00:39:40.480
what his goals are? Walker? Why don't I just tell

725
00:39:40.519 --> 00:39:41.519
you what your goals are?

726
00:39:43.119 --> 00:39:45.360
Well? Why don't, Kevin, I've spent way too much time talking.

727
00:39:45.360 --> 00:39:47.199
Why don't you tell me why that doesn't work when

728
00:39:47.239 --> 00:39:48.360
you give somebody their goals?

729
00:39:48.360 --> 00:39:50.719
Because I'm not excited about what somebody gave me. I'm

730
00:39:50.760 --> 00:39:55.280
excited about or potentially excited about what I want to accomplish.

731
00:39:56.000 --> 00:39:56.159
Right.

732
00:39:56.159 --> 00:39:59.039
We always talk about personal goals as well as professional goals,

733
00:39:59.079 --> 00:40:01.639
and I've told people for twenty something years, yeah, you

734
00:40:01.679 --> 00:40:05.119
got have professional goals, but really they're in supporting your

735
00:40:05.119 --> 00:40:07.679
personal goals. Right, So what do you want to accomplish personally?

736
00:40:07.719 --> 00:40:12.119
That's way more important because it's personal and everybody's different.

737
00:40:12.199 --> 00:40:15.840
There are some categories that are similar, Right, who do

738
00:40:15.920 --> 00:40:17.599
I want to spend time with? What do you want

739
00:40:17.599 --> 00:40:20.599
to do financially? Is it physical? You want to make

740
00:40:20.639 --> 00:40:24.400
a difference in the community, family? Right, depending on where

741
00:40:24.400 --> 00:40:27.519
you are. You know, I want to spend time with family.

742
00:40:28.400 --> 00:40:30.199
To Matt's point earlier, you know, I don't want to

743
00:40:30.199 --> 00:40:34.119
spend all my time working. I want them to know me. Right,

744
00:40:34.360 --> 00:40:36.679
I have grandkids now I want to spend time with them.

745
00:40:36.679 --> 00:40:37.960
I don't want to be working all the time. And

746
00:40:38.000 --> 00:40:40.519
as much as I work a lot, I do have limits.

747
00:40:41.079 --> 00:40:45.320
So if working thirty five hours and making the same

748
00:40:45.559 --> 00:40:47.039
is a goal, why not pick that goal?

749
00:40:47.119 --> 00:40:47.280
You know?

750
00:40:47.320 --> 00:40:49.800
If maxing out a four to one K plan is

751
00:40:49.840 --> 00:40:52.280
important to somebody, why not that goal? If taking a

752
00:40:52.320 --> 00:40:54.719
trip to Europe in twelve months is important, why not

753
00:40:54.760 --> 00:40:58.400
pick that goal? Because then, if it's important enough, aren't

754
00:40:58.440 --> 00:41:02.639
people encouraged to do what they got to do professionally

755
00:41:02.760 --> 00:41:07.079
to make the money they need personally? And this applies

756
00:41:07.119 --> 00:41:08.960
this meth you know, what we're talking about here applies

757
00:41:08.960 --> 00:41:12.079
more to salespeople because those of us in our profession

758
00:41:12.440 --> 00:41:14.639
we sell more, we make more. So it probably doesn't

759
00:41:14.679 --> 00:41:17.840
apply to a you know, a salaried worker, you know

760
00:41:17.840 --> 00:41:19.800
they can double their effectiveness and get a raise at

761
00:41:19.800 --> 00:41:20.400
the end of the year.

762
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:25.079
But it does and it really doesn't matter what you do.

763
00:41:26.239 --> 00:41:30.679
You in the end, you're either controlled by choices or

764
00:41:30.719 --> 00:41:32.280
conditions you get to pick.

765
00:41:33.320 --> 00:41:33.960
Well, that's good.

766
00:41:34.639 --> 00:41:37.440
Essentially you get to choose whether or not you want

767
00:41:37.480 --> 00:41:41.039
to live by choice, and the goals that you set

768
00:41:41.239 --> 00:41:44.440
are the choices that you make. You know. Last what,

769
00:41:44.599 --> 00:41:49.440
June twenty third of twenty twenty three, my wife asked

770
00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:53.880
me how much I weighed, which is not something she.

771
00:41:53.880 --> 00:41:56.039
Asked you if you had reached your goal weight. Yet

772
00:41:57.159 --> 00:41:59.079
She's like, how much do you weigh?

773
00:41:59.239 --> 00:42:01.760
And I'm like, well, that's odd because I've never said

774
00:42:01.760 --> 00:42:06.679
that to you in our thirty years together. Yes, So

775
00:42:07.039 --> 00:42:08.880
I told her the number. It was two sixty five

776
00:42:08.920 --> 00:42:10.880
and I had never weighed that much, and she said, jeez,

777
00:42:10.840 --> 00:42:12.880
that's that's a lot. What do you think about losing

778
00:42:12.920 --> 00:42:17.079
some weight? And I was just about to say something,

779
00:42:17.239 --> 00:42:19.320
and she said, here's the thing I've been looking at

780
00:42:19.440 --> 00:42:21.920
on a diet starting July first, we're going to do

781
00:42:21.960 --> 00:42:25.800
this diet for ninety days. It's completely unsustainable over the

782
00:42:25.840 --> 00:42:28.280
long term, but when we're at the end of that

783
00:42:28.360 --> 00:42:30.679
ninety days, we can figure out what we want to

784
00:42:30.719 --> 00:42:34.320
do for our diet going forward. And so we got

785
00:42:34.320 --> 00:42:36.440
to the end of that ninety days. I weighed to fourteen,

786
00:42:36.960 --> 00:42:39.440
which was five pounds less than I had weighed in college.

787
00:42:39.639 --> 00:42:43.400
That's upstanding, so unbelievable.

788
00:42:43.679 --> 00:42:46.719
But it wasn't a big complex, you know. Kind of

789
00:42:47.119 --> 00:42:49.920
it was, Hey, I'm going to do this, and it's

790
00:42:49.960 --> 00:42:52.239
going to change the diet that I prepare for dinner.

791
00:42:52.559 --> 00:42:55.599
And I know you don't cook, so listen, Fatty, you're

792
00:42:55.639 --> 00:43:00.400
going to lose a couple pounds. But on the other hand,

793
00:43:00.440 --> 00:43:03.239
now there were a lot of good add on effects

794
00:43:03.239 --> 00:43:06.239
for me. My heart rates down, my heart rate variabilities up.

795
00:43:06.360 --> 00:43:08.599
I mean, it's all kinds of good things happened out

796
00:43:08.639 --> 00:43:14.440
of it, but it really was a two person kind

797
00:43:14.480 --> 00:43:18.159
of Hey, we agreed on this, our kids held us

798
00:43:18.159 --> 00:43:20.679
accountable to what we said we were going to eat,

799
00:43:21.199 --> 00:43:24.320
and we were able to measure and manage the entire

800
00:43:24.400 --> 00:43:27.960
process for ninety days. But then we had to make

801
00:43:28.000 --> 00:43:30.880
a decision about whether or not we wanted to do

802
00:43:30.960 --> 00:43:37.760
that on an ongoing basis, which we unfortunately have unfortunately have.

803
00:43:39.519 --> 00:43:42.079
You know what's funny is and you said it, I'll

804
00:43:42.280 --> 00:43:45.760
make it clear. Your goals have to they have to

805
00:43:45.840 --> 00:43:48.679
matter to you, right, and so people they'll make one

806
00:43:48.719 --> 00:43:51.000
hundred thousand dollars or five hundred thousand dollars, but the reason,

807
00:43:51.119 --> 00:43:53.760
But then it's why do you have why do you

808
00:43:53.800 --> 00:43:55.960
want to do that? Why do you really care? And

809
00:43:56.000 --> 00:43:58.000
then know really why?

810
00:43:58.480 --> 00:44:01.679
And what happens if you don't what happens if you don't?

811
00:44:02.239 --> 00:44:08.360
And and so if you're if you're not excited about

812
00:44:08.360 --> 00:44:10.679
your goals. So if the company says you need to

813
00:44:10.679 --> 00:44:13.000
sell your goals need to a million dollars this year,

814
00:44:13.480 --> 00:44:15.320
and you go and then they drop balloons and the

815
00:44:15.400 --> 00:44:18.039
music goes, yeah, million dollars, right, and you go, what

816
00:44:18.079 --> 00:44:19.880
the hell does that mean to me? And so it's

817
00:44:20.000 --> 00:44:22.679
much if somebody were to say to you, I mean, oftentimes,

818
00:44:23.119 --> 00:44:26.639
if you had a goal and you didn't know the

819
00:44:26.639 --> 00:44:29.440
company's goal, you're and you knew what why it had

820
00:44:29.480 --> 00:44:31.559
to matter and why you cared. Your goal is probably

821
00:44:31.639 --> 00:44:34.760
hiring the company's goal in pay, and you'll I mean,

822
00:44:34.840 --> 00:44:36.960
I know, I will book aus I work myself now,

823
00:44:37.000 --> 00:44:39.280
but I will fight to the death to make stuff

824
00:44:39.280 --> 00:44:42.639
happen for me. But but maybe not so much if

825
00:44:42.639 --> 00:44:45.239
it's just if I don't give a shit as the company, right,

826
00:44:45.320 --> 00:44:50.400
I mean, which is which is honestly right? Sales is

827
00:44:50.440 --> 00:44:53.920
all about your prospect. Goals are all about the person

828
00:44:54.039 --> 00:44:56.880
to whom it impacts. It's got to be there's got

829
00:44:56.920 --> 00:44:59.960
to be a personal, compelling reason, a gap between where

830
00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:01.880
they are and where they want to be that has

831
00:45:01.960 --> 00:45:04.880
to be closed. Those are the best kind of goals.

832
00:45:05.000 --> 00:45:07.400
I would add that the only time I think it

833
00:45:07.440 --> 00:45:12.360
could that a goal could be not about the individuals

834
00:45:12.400 --> 00:45:16.159
is if it's for someone they care about. Oh right, right, right,

835
00:45:16.199 --> 00:45:18.920
So maybe I don't need the additional money, but my

836
00:45:18.960 --> 00:45:21.760
wife does, my kid does for school or something. Right.

837
00:45:22.039 --> 00:45:23.800
Just know, we all to do that shit for ourselves too.

838
00:45:24.039 --> 00:45:26.559
Yeah, Well, I don't know if you guys, remember, we

839
00:45:26.639 --> 00:45:29.199
used to have an assessment that measured goal orientation on

840
00:45:29.239 --> 00:45:31.960
a scale of zero to nine. Yep, And we were

841
00:45:31.960 --> 00:45:34.119
all like, oh, nine means you have a super high

842
00:45:34.199 --> 00:45:37.719
goal orientation. Well, you can have a super high individual

843
00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:41.199
goal orientation. But I had one of my most successful

844
00:45:41.199 --> 00:45:44.519
sales reps had a sales a goal orientation of zero.

845
00:45:45.960 --> 00:45:49.239
I'm like, dude, I don't get it, Like, why would

846
00:45:49.280 --> 00:45:51.480
you do any of this? This all sucks? What are

847
00:45:51.519 --> 00:45:55.119
you trying to accomplish? And all he could talk about

848
00:45:55.360 --> 00:45:58.840
was the importance of his team winning well. And so

849
00:45:58.880 --> 00:46:01.760
there are people that have a high goal orientation for

850
00:46:01.880 --> 00:46:07.400
the team. But what I think goal orientation really is

851
00:46:07.440 --> 00:46:10.880
all about is we have a spark of something that

852
00:46:10.920 --> 00:46:14.960
we see ourselves as that we're willing to chase.

853
00:46:16.159 --> 00:46:16.639
That's good.

854
00:46:16.800 --> 00:46:20.559
And if you don't have it, because you don't have goals,

855
00:46:21.159 --> 00:46:24.360
well then you're never going to wait that spark. But

856
00:46:24.400 --> 00:46:27.159
if you do have it, the clearer your goal and

857
00:46:27.239 --> 00:46:29.920
the more people hold you accountable to painting that picture,

858
00:46:31.159 --> 00:46:34.119
you know, the more likely you are to actually accomplish

859
00:46:34.119 --> 00:46:36.719
that goal, which is where the accountability really kicks in.

860
00:46:37.199 --> 00:46:37.760
That's good.

861
00:46:38.199 --> 00:46:40.559
I have a slightly different spin on that. I believe

862
00:46:40.599 --> 00:46:44.000
the person that makes the goal that says that by

863
00:46:44.000 --> 00:46:46.920
the end of this I want this to happen. I

864
00:46:46.960 --> 00:46:49.400
believe the person once you reach that goal, you're a

865
00:46:49.400 --> 00:46:51.840
different person than the person that made it, that this

866
00:46:51.960 --> 00:46:54.159
is the fire you go through to get.

867
00:46:54.039 --> 00:46:56.760
There, well as the carving of the statue.

868
00:46:57.119 --> 00:47:02.480
Yeah right, yeah, we talk about the byproducts of the

869
00:47:02.480 --> 00:47:04.760
goal right now, you know how to lose weight and

870
00:47:04.760 --> 00:47:07.159
stay healthy, mat So the goal was get to a

871
00:47:07.159 --> 00:47:11.000
certain way. But the byproduct, right you know how to

872
00:47:11.000 --> 00:47:13.239
stay there? You know how to you know what behavis

873
00:47:13.239 --> 00:47:15.639
you had to change. Hey, we're almost out of time.

874
00:47:15.639 --> 00:47:17.679
I have one more question, actually two more questions. First

875
00:47:17.760 --> 00:47:21.000
is what book are you reading? And based upon how

876
00:47:21.079 --> 00:47:22.440
far are you in too that book right now? What's

877
00:47:22.480 --> 00:47:23.199
your key takeaway?

878
00:47:24.639 --> 00:47:30.760
Good, Matt, Not why I'm not reading Walker's book yet,

879
00:47:31.239 --> 00:47:33.559
although he is the number one seller on Amazon and

880
00:47:33.639 --> 00:47:34.119
New Business.

881
00:47:34.199 --> 00:47:36.719
Yes, yes, why it was the seller right here, some

882
00:47:36.800 --> 00:47:39.119
will somewhat my copy.

883
00:47:39.199 --> 00:47:43.719
Yet the book that I'm actually reading right now, that's

884
00:47:43.840 --> 00:47:46.239
that's been pretty interesting to me is The Psychology of Money.

885
00:47:46.840 --> 00:47:50.519
Oh that's good, yes, as Yeah.

886
00:47:50.440 --> 00:47:53.920
Great book, great book and It's interesting because a lot

887
00:47:53.920 --> 00:47:57.239
of the book is about the psychology of planning with

888
00:47:57.320 --> 00:48:03.519
failure in mind. So that's good, yeah, Walker, other than

889
00:48:03.519 --> 00:48:06.719
your own book, Walker, right, I am not I have been.

890
00:48:07.079 --> 00:48:07.800
Are you going to read it?

891
00:48:07.800 --> 00:48:11.079
By the way, my book, I've read it six hundred

892
00:48:11.119 --> 00:48:14.719
and twenty seven times for every edit and so actually

893
00:48:14.960 --> 00:48:17.360
I found myself flipping through it today and I realized,

894
00:48:17.360 --> 00:48:19.039
I don't want to see anything that's wrong with it.

895
00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:23.239
So I actually am reading rereading a book, which I

896
00:48:23.960 --> 00:48:26.239
hadn't been in that practice. Once I read a book,

897
00:48:26.280 --> 00:48:28.840
I'd put it down forever. And this is not a

898
00:48:28.880 --> 00:48:31.800
business book. It's it's the Confederacy of Dunces. I don't

899
00:48:31.800 --> 00:48:35.480
know if you guys have read the o'tool.

900
00:48:35.119 --> 00:48:35.960
I think is his name.

901
00:48:36.400 --> 00:48:39.119
It is about loud funny. I take it with me

902
00:48:39.159 --> 00:48:42.519
in the deer stand and it just I've thoroughly enjoyed it.

903
00:48:42.519 --> 00:48:44.480
I've been away from the business books for a couple

904
00:48:44.519 --> 00:48:46.440
of months, but that was That's what I've reading right now.

905
00:48:46.639 --> 00:48:48.079
How about you, Kevin love that book.

906
00:48:48.480 --> 00:48:51.480
Yeah, I've got three books going right now, The Unbreakable Investor,

907
00:48:51.599 --> 00:48:55.920
Charles Payne, Atomic Habits, and The Compound Effect. Both I

908
00:48:55.920 --> 00:48:58.519
mean all three good one. You know, one is about money,

909
00:48:58.519 --> 00:49:03.039
obviously atomic cab. It's about small changes, compound effect. Really too,

910
00:49:03.280 --> 00:49:05.199
it's just as easy to set a bad habit as

911
00:49:05.199 --> 00:49:07.960
a good habit, so why not pick the good habit?

912
00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:11.280
And he gives you tools for doing that. That's James Clear,

913
00:49:11.480 --> 00:49:13.239
powerful story too, of his life.

914
00:49:13.840 --> 00:49:16.320
I thought I would give a shout out to a

915
00:49:16.360 --> 00:49:19.440
podcast that I have loved is the Founder's Podcast.

916
00:49:19.719 --> 00:49:21.039
Oh yes, that's good.

917
00:49:21.559 --> 00:49:26.199
I'm a subscriber to that with this guy has read

918
00:49:26.599 --> 00:49:29.599
he reads biographies of people, the founders of companies, and

919
00:49:29.639 --> 00:49:34.000
then he does somewhere between probably an hour an hour

920
00:49:34.039 --> 00:49:37.039
and twenty minutes on the things that founders of other

921
00:49:37.079 --> 00:49:40.119
companies need to know from that book. And it is

922
00:49:40.679 --> 00:49:44.679
super interesting. He's very excited about it. He's an expert

923
00:49:44.719 --> 00:49:48.039
in so many things, and he's he can recall he'll

924
00:49:48.039 --> 00:49:49.920
start talking about Warren Buffett will So this reminds me

925
00:49:49.960 --> 00:49:52.199
of Steve Jobs over here and Jay z over there.

926
00:49:52.239 --> 00:49:56.079
And it's really the Founder's Podcast. I'm a big fan.

927
00:49:57.119 --> 00:50:01.000
Awesome, all right, last question, each of you answer this,

928
00:50:01.119 --> 00:50:04.199
who in the listening and viewing audiences should reach out

929
00:50:04.199 --> 00:50:08.079
to you? Why and why and then how do they

930
00:50:08.119 --> 00:50:11.800
get in touch with them? And want's got the contact

931
00:50:11.800 --> 00:50:14.039
information and scroll, so maybe we can skip that part.

932
00:50:15.880 --> 00:50:16.679
Walker, go ahead.

933
00:50:17.880 --> 00:50:22.719
So I work with companies, typically in the Southeast, that

934
00:50:22.800 --> 00:50:27.280
have sales teams spread out over you know, three or

935
00:50:27.360 --> 00:50:32.119
four different markets. Typically we sell some expensive and complicated

936
00:50:33.079 --> 00:50:35.639
and the owner is kind of ambitious, a little bit

937
00:50:35.639 --> 00:50:37.760
of a maverick, and says, we need to we want

938
00:50:37.800 --> 00:50:41.519
an unfair advantage in the marketplace, and so we work

939
00:50:41.559 --> 00:50:44.239
with them to give them an unfair advantage based upon

940
00:50:44.360 --> 00:50:45.719
the sales process they follow.

941
00:50:46.079 --> 00:50:49.199
Excellent, And there's Walker's info right there. It's Walker at

942
00:50:49.239 --> 00:50:51.840
walkermackay dot com. Is the easiest go ahead, Matt.

943
00:50:53.320 --> 00:50:57.519
I work with primarily two to fifty million dollar businesses,

944
00:50:57.920 --> 00:51:03.280
typically in the Midwest. They are a premium solution compared

945
00:51:03.280 --> 00:51:06.960
to their competitors, and they have a burning desire to

946
00:51:07.079 --> 00:51:10.320
continue to gain share in their market. It's important to

947
00:51:10.360 --> 00:51:12.079
them and they can't figure out why they're not doing

948
00:51:12.119 --> 00:51:12.760
it more quickly.

949
00:51:13.440 --> 00:51:17.960
That's good and it's Matt dot Nettleton at Sandler dot com. Guys,

950
00:51:18.000 --> 00:51:20.760
thank you so much. Oh by the book. Some will

951
00:51:21.000 --> 00:51:26.199
some won't sow what Who's next? Amazon dot com Walker,

952
00:51:26.960 --> 00:51:29.880
leave me a review. Review it, everybody, come on review

953
00:51:29.920 --> 00:51:32.000
it all right, guys, Thank you You've been great. This

954
00:51:32.119 --> 00:51:33.360
was fun for me and I hope it was fun

955
00:51:33.360 --> 00:51:33.800
for you too.

956
00:51:34.400 --> 00:51:38.280
Super fun. Thanks Kevin, Thanks Matt, Greg with you doing Walker.

957
00:51:38.679 --> 00:51:40.920
And thanks everybody for watching and listening. This is a

958
00:51:40.960 --> 00:51:43.719
show about business and often business challenges. If you get

959
00:51:43.719 --> 00:51:47.199
concerns about the sales effectiveness of your company, whether your

960
00:51:47.239 --> 00:51:49.679
sales team is one or many, give me a call.

961
00:51:50.360 --> 00:51:53.800
You can reach out to me at LinkedIn. I'm on LinkedIn.

962
00:51:53.960 --> 00:51:57.320
You can message me or Kevin at Winning Business Radio

963
00:51:57.440 --> 00:52:01.000
dot com. Our company is Winning Incorporated, part of Sandler Training.

964
00:52:01.039 --> 00:52:05.199
We develop sales teams into high achievers and sales leaders

965
00:52:05.320 --> 00:52:08.039
into true coaches and mentors. We're not right for everybody,

966
00:52:08.079 --> 00:52:10.519
but hey, maybe we should talk. Thank you again to

967
00:52:10.559 --> 00:52:13.199
Engineering our producer Wan for another job well done. Thank

968
00:52:13.199 --> 00:52:16.960
you one. Be sure to join next week Monday, November eighteenth,

969
00:52:17.000 --> 00:52:20.760
when my guest will be Catherine Tag of Influence Digital Media.

970
00:52:20.920 --> 00:52:21.480
See you then.

971
00:52:23.239 --> 00:52:26.000
You've been listening to Winning Business Radio with your host

972
00:52:26.159 --> 00:52:29.239
Kevin Helenan. If you missed any part of this episode,

973
00:52:29.360 --> 00:52:33.519
the podcast is available on Talk for podcasting and iHeartRadio.

974
00:52:33.960 --> 00:52:37.679
For more information and questions, go to Winning Business Radio

975
00:52:37.800 --> 00:52:40.800
dot com or check us out on social media. Tune

976
00:52:40.840 --> 00:52:42.920
in again next week and every Monday at four pm

977
00:52:42.920 --> 00:52:46.440
Eastern Time to listen live to Winning Business Radio on

978
00:52:46.719 --> 00:52:51.000
W four CY Radio w fourcy dot com. Until then,

979
00:52:51.320 --> 00:52:54.960
let's succeed where others have failed and win in business

980
00:52:55.239 --> 00:52:59.599
with Kevin Helenan and Winning Business Radio