Oct. 7, 2024

Evan Polin, President of Polin Performance Group LLC

Evan Polin, President of Polin Performance Group LLC

Evan Polin, President of Polin Performance Group, brings 20+ years of sales experience to his clients maximizing their business development and sales results via coaching, consulting, and fractional sales management.

Evan specializes in working with...

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Evan Polin, President of Polin Performance Group, brings 20+ years of sales experience to his clients maximizing their business development and sales results via coaching, consulting, and fractional sales management.

Evan specializes in working with non-selling professionals, having co-authored Selling Professional Services the Sandler Way: Nobody Ever Told Me I’d Have to Sell, which focuses on business development for attorneys, accountants, consultants and other service professionals.

Winning Business Radio is broadcast live Mondays at 4PM ET and Music on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Winning Business Radio is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).

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WEBVTT

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The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are

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solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not

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those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We

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make no recommendations or endorsements radio show, programs, services, or

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products mentioned on air or on our web. No liability

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explicit or implies shall be extended to W four CY

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Radio or it's employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments

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should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for

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choosing W FOURCY Radio.

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Churchill said, those who failed to learn from history are

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condemned to repeat it. Kevin Helenan believes that certainly applies

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to business. Welcome to Winning Business Radio here at W

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four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com and

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now your host, Kevin Helena.

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Thanks everybody for joining in again today. I am Kevin

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Haleanan and welcome back to Winning Business TV and Radio

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on W four orcy dot com. We're streaming live on

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talkfour tv dot com, and of course we're on Facebook

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live at Winning Business Radio, and of course we're available

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after the after the show in podcast form on tons

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of platforms pretty much wherever you go for your platform,

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excuse me for your podcast content, YouTube, iHeartRadio, Spotify, Apple.

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The list goes on the mission of the show winning

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business radio and TV, as regular listeners and viewers know,

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is to offer insights and advice. Really to help people

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avoid the mistakes of others, right to learn the best practices,

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the how tos, the what toos, the what not tos

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for sure, and to be challenged and hopefully to be

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inspired by the successes of others. Consultants, coaches, authors, advisors,

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founders and owners, entrepreneurs, people with expertise and often vision.

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But as I always say, virtually every successful person that

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I've ever had a chance to talk to has said

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some form of failure in their lives and careers. So

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you heard every week while we all to get our

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knee skinned once in a while, I'm driven to keep

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those scrapes from needing major surgery. Let's endeavor to learn

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from history so we don't repeat it. I've spent the

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better part of my career equipping businesses to grow from

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solopreneurs to small and medium sized companies all the way

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up to the Fortune fifty. I've seen some of those

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companies win and to varying degrees. I've seen some fail

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I've had the opportunity to rub shoulders with some of

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the highest performing people around, with some who probably should

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have found oh excuse me, and with some who should

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have found other professions. And in my own businesses, I've

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had a lot of success, but some failures too. I

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like to think I've learned a lot along the way.

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So you'll hear from me my opinions and insights, but

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more importantly, you'll hear from my guests. And today we

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have a great guest. His name is Evan Poland. He's

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the president of Poland Performance Group. Here's his bio. Evan

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Poland Performance of Poland Performance Group LLC brings over twenty

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years of sales coaching and consulting expertise to help his

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clients maximize their business development and sales results. Hevin takes

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a customized approach to working with his clients as he

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focuses on the mindsets, a business development plan and professional

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sales skills needed to grow a business. He's presented at

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national and regional conferences and has led business development, sales, prospecting, management,

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and customer service programs across the country. He earned his

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BA from the University of Delaware and a master's degree

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from UPenn. He's the co author of the book Selling

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Professional Services The sandther Way. Nobody ever told me I'd

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have to sell love that title, even, which focuses on

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business development for attorneys, accountants, consultants, and other service professionals.

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Evan provides sales coaching, consulting, and fractional sales management services

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to growing companies and professional services. Yeah, I can talk.

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I'll try that again, professional service firms seeking an increase

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in sales profits and productivity. Evan combines his mental health

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and counseling background with his professional sales and sales coaching

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experience to help his clients achieve results that exceed their expectations.

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Evan grew up in the Philadelphia area and currently resides

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in South Jersey with his wife Karen, his teenage son Jake,

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and his Mini burn Doodle. Mini Burn Doodle. I'll have

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to ask you about Harper and his free time. Evan

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enjoys spending time with family and friends, traveling, and cheering

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on his beloved Philadelphia sports teams. Evan, welcome to Winning

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Business Radio and TV.

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Thanks Kevin, I really appreciate you having.

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Me well I'm glad you're here. I know you're busy.

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I appreciate you taking the time. Start with your family.

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Tell us a little about Karen, your wife.

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So, my wife has a background in management consulting. She

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went to Bucknell, worked for Booz Allen for a very

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long time on their on their government side, had her

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fill of working for a large corporation for a while,

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went in and worked with a UI firm I'm really

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helping with project management, overseeing their teams. And that company

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was acquired by a fortune one hundred company and she

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was there to the first part of COVID and then

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made a career change. Didn't love project management, transitioned over

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into the HR world, and she is now head of

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US and Canada for HR for a fortune five hundred

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firm called IQB, and she loves doing what she's doing,

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is really happy about that career transition that she made.

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And your son, Jake, So, my son is a senior

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in high school. So if anybody out in the listening

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audience is a college admissions counselor and wants to help

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us out, were anyone looking looking to fund someone going

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to school, was still open for him to be adopted

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so just just let us know if you want to help.

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But he is a senior in high school involved in Decca,

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which is a marketing group model you in. Yeah, there's

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academic bowl team for his high school. So he's really

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active and involved, but really really looking forward to leaving

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his parents and spreading his wings and definitely told us

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he's going away for college.

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Nice. And how far does that mean California, Florida.

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Depends where you go to one or two of his

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reach schools that are you top and he wants to

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get into a business program would be a flight away,

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but most of the schools are within a three or

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four hour drive of where we live, right outside of Philadelphia.

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Nice. All right, So tell us about your burn doodle, Harper.

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She's a mini Burner Doodle, which is a mix between

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a Burmese mountain dog and a miniature poodle. So she

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was a COVID dog. So my son had been begging

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and begging and begging for a dog, and between my

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wife's travel my travel, the excuse was it wasn't fair

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to have a dog alone home alone for twelve hours

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about six months into COVID. My son was like, Okay,

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well you're not going anywhere, and you're both working from

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home now. So so we got Harper, who was a

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total sweetheart. Hopefully she won't make an appearance on camera today.

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She does, It's okay, just introduce her.

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So she is a goofy dog, well natured dog, and

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she loves being spoiled, and we're very good at spoiling her.

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Nice. I love it all right. So tell us a

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bit about your background. You grew up in Philly.

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So I grew up in New Jersey area, right outside

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of Philadelphia. Never went too far. I went to the

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University of Delaware for college and got undergraduate degrees in

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psychology and sociology, which allowed me to go to graduate school.

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And that's pretty much all that qualified me for So,

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so I went to University of Pennsylvania got a master's

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degree in social work. I really enjoy doing things around

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surrounding the work had a specialty in something called employee

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assistance counseling.

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I wanted all about that. What does that mean?

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So I was the guy and I worked for a

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subsidiary of United Healthcare. So when somebody tested positive for

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drugs or alcohol at work, there was a threat of

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violence in work. I was the one that got the

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phone call when they called their insurance company, helped to

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kind of treize the situation get somebody set up for treatment.

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I would also be involved in tracking their treatment, helping

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to determine when somebody could return to work. And then

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I also acquired another specialty in something called critical as

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it stress debriefings. So after a bank robbery, after a

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liquor store robbery, if there was an accident on a

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train line, I would go in meet with the employees

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that were affected, try to minimize the risk of them

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having post traumatic stress disorder, and then helping to get

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them set up with long term counsel services if they

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needed it, which quite frankly in this dovetailing how I

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got into doing what I'm doing After nine to eleven,

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I was new into my career doing sales training and

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sales coaching. Nine to eleven hit and I'm about an

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hour and a half outside of New York. Got called

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by the managed care company and ended up spending about

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a month and a half in New York living in

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my friend's apartment who had got displaced because his company

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was right next to the Lotate Center, and I was

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meeting with companies every single day, who had hundreds and

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hundreds of employees impacted by nine to eleven people who

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were going to four or five funerals a day, and

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I was there kind of doing a group processing session

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with them, counseling session with them, getting them connected with treatment,

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and did that for about two months after nine to eleven.

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So that is not at all what I expected it

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to be. That's fascinating. I want to ask you a

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few questions that group guidance. What did that look like?

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I mean, really people benefit from the individualized or small group,

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whatever that looks like. But how do you work with

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a whole team of people? Initially, so a lot.

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Of people are going through the same emotions, don't realize

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that other people are going through the same thing they're

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going through, So helping to give them an idea of

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what they may be currently experiencing, what they can expect

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the experience over the next couple of days, so that

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they're not surprised, they don't think that they're abnormal. Also

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kind of help helping people who were comfortable kind of

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express what they saw, how they felt, so that they

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could start to process their feelings. Because a lot of

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times people get PTSD when they keep everything pushed down,

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don't know how to express their emotions, don't know how

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to express their feelings. And then right there and then

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would give them how to get connected with their insurance,

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with their EAP benefits, with their counseling, so that they

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could get that individualized counseling. But a lot of times

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if people, if it wasn't normalized, people wouldn't feel comfortable

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reaching out to get that help. So it helps to

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kind of start with that process.

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Well, and I see that you or I read somewhere

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that you reference your time in behavioral health with some

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of the work you do now working with sales organizations salespeople.

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Yeah. Absolutely, and we can talk a little bit about

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it about how I've transformed a little bit, how I've

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been in the business. And again, I know you work

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with a ton of salespeople, and as we both know,

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a lot of times, the biggest challenges helping people get

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out of their own way, it's not that they don't

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know what they should be doing. It's that, for whatever reason,

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they're not doing those things that they know they should

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be doing. So I'll spend a lot of my time

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and a lot of my experience from counseling, helping people

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to kind of understand why they're not doing what they're doing,

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helping them determine whether or not the results that they

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would be getting if they were doing those things is

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worth the discomfort of taking risk. In the intro, you

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talked a little bit about failure of that willingness to

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go out and try something new, that willingness to fail

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a little bit at the beginning. And if I can

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help the people to get beyond that, to go out

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and try something new, then there's a much better chance

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that they'll actually take action on what I suggest, versus

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giving them what could be the best ideas in the world.

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But if they're actually not willing to go out and

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take the risk to try it, it doesn't matter what

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tools you give someone. If they're not willing to use them,

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they're not going to see any change and they're not

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going to see any results.

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Totally true. You're spot on, Hey, blue or not, we're

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going to take our first break right here. We'll be

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back in just about a minute. Evan and everybody will

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be back with Evan Poland in just just about one minute.

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Excuse me, you're listening to Winning business Radio with Kevin

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Helene on W four CY Radio. That's W four cy

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And now back to Winning Business Radio with Kevin helenan

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presenting exciting topics and expert guests with one goal in

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mind to help you succeed in business. Here once again,

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he's Kevin Helen at.

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Okay, we're back with Evan Poland, president of Poland Performance Group.

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Here's what I want to know now, fascinating behavioral health background.

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How did you cross over? How did you get into

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the sales universe?

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So a great question, and I jokingly say that I

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was born into it. So right when I started college,

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my parents bought a saandlor training franchise and one summer

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while I was in college, I had a sales job.

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I was calling nonprofits, churches, synagogues's youth groups to try

252
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to get them to sell these coupon books for fundraisers.

253
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So I decided to sit through the sales training one

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summer when I was in college. I did it again

255
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when I was in graduate school and then although I

256
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loved my social work career my social work background, for

257
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private counseling sessions, I was getting paid somewhere between twenty

258
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five and thirty five dollars per session. I was working

259
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for a part of United Healthcare. I was very fortunate

260
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that I had a good mentor ID got promoted twice

261
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in my first three years, had an opportunity to speak

262
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at a national conference. Was involved when they do the

263
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dog and Ponies sale shows when they would bring through

264
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a big prospect. But my next promotion was about ten

265
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years away, looking at about two and a half to

266
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three and a half percent salary increases per year. My

267
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parents' business partner was my uncle who had been dating

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a woman for about twenty years who we were in

269
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the Philadelphia area, lived in Dallas.

270
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You don't want to rush in any things, Yeah, I didn't.

271
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Want to rush in anything. I was told it was

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time to make a decision, so he transitioned out. I

273
00:15:52.080 --> 00:15:55.279
wasn't happy with what I was doing, so I decided

274
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to join my parents in the business. That was two

275
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in one. I mistakenly thought that I was joining a

276
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coaching and training product.

277
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I knew you were going to say that, that's so many.

278
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People I occasionally had to sell. I quickly realized if

279
00:16:13.559 --> 00:16:15.879
I wanted to do any training your coaching, if I

280
00:16:15.919 --> 00:16:18.399
didn't have any clients to do training and coaching with,

281
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then I didn't get a chance to do that. So

282
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I'm not I'm not the sharpest tool. I'm not the

283
00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:27.320
quickest So it took me a little while to figure

284
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that out. But I really had to move out of

285
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my comfort zone as a non selling professional, somebody with

286
00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:37.440
a non traditional background to really kind of make that

287
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transition and be successful going from that social work background,

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in the mental health background to know being a professional consultant.

289
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And as you know, I'm not sure a lot of

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00:16:49.080 --> 00:16:51.320
a lot of others do. They'll learn in a second

291
00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:57.519
here there is so much psychology in selling entirety. Touch

292
00:16:57.600 --> 00:17:00.159
on just one or two easy areas. We'll get more

293
00:17:00.159 --> 00:17:03.000
into that in a few minutes, but just show people

294
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that I'm right on that one. Not that I'm not

295
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trying to be right. I'm just saying, you know, so

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two things.

297
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One again from the salesperson, from the consultants' mentality. Again,

298
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if they're not willing to look at what's keeping them

299
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in a term, I know you know very well in

300
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a comfort zone that they're not going to be able

301
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to unlock themselves to try to do something new to

302
00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:26.480
get better results. And if you think that everybody is

303
00:17:26.519 --> 00:17:29.759
the same and you treat every possible thing, you're not

304
00:17:29.839 --> 00:17:33.160
going to get the same reaction. So it's a matter

305
00:17:33.200 --> 00:17:36.079
of being able to read other people and also understand

306
00:17:36.880 --> 00:17:40.279
that you know people don't only at least buy intellectually,

307
00:17:40.799 --> 00:17:44.000
that there's a lot of emotion involved. And if you

308
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can't understand what motivates someone unless they have a desperate

309
00:17:48.559 --> 00:17:50.960
need for your product or service at the exact moment

310
00:17:51.000 --> 00:17:53.559
that you talk to them, the chances of getting them

311
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to buy into whatever it is that you're selling aren't

312
00:17:56.799 --> 00:17:59.640
very good. And those salespeople who just try to memorize

313
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this or try to just kind of bulldog their way

314
00:18:02.519 --> 00:18:08.119
through guilty end up having to do three times as

315
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much activity and getting very frustrated, and they're saying things

316
00:18:11.680 --> 00:18:14.400
like I, why doesn't my prospect understand that this is

317
00:18:14.440 --> 00:18:16.240
good for them? And why don't they do what I want?

318
00:18:16.400 --> 00:18:22.519
I know I can help them. Yeah, yeah, so go ahead.

319
00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:23.000
I'm sorry.

320
00:18:23.079 --> 00:18:26.000
If you don't understand the psychology and if you don't

321
00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:29.440
understand what motivates people to make a decision, you're going

322
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to have a very difficult time.

323
00:18:31.079 --> 00:18:34.720
Yeah, that's really good. So many of your clients included

324
00:18:34.839 --> 00:18:41.119
law firms, banks, financial service firms, architectural engineering firms, professional

325
00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:45.200
consulting organizations, people who you and I would call non

326
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and you reference the term already non selling professionals. Why

327
00:18:49.119 --> 00:18:51.960
do we call them non selling professionals.

328
00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:56.759
Because they would be highly offended if you ever told

329
00:18:56.799 --> 00:19:00.480
them that they were selling. Yeah, they went this because

330
00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:02.440
they were very smart people and they went to school

331
00:19:02.480 --> 00:19:05.759
to do other things, and sales was not supposed to

332
00:19:05.799 --> 00:19:09.359
be part of the equation. So for a lot of them,

333
00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:12.920
it's difficult for them to conceive of themselves as that way.

334
00:19:14.359 --> 00:19:19.319
For a lot of them, they're already very uncomfortable. So again,

335
00:19:19.759 --> 00:19:22.920
just our secret. I'm sure nobody else is listening. Don't

336
00:19:22.960 --> 00:19:26.279
tell them that they're selling, but soften it up a

337
00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:29.480
little bit. If we share with them how they can

338
00:19:29.599 --> 00:19:32.799
use their expertise to help people solve their problems, it

339
00:19:32.839 --> 00:19:35.559
makes them a lot more comfortable and they're a lot

340
00:19:35.599 --> 00:19:38.240
more willing to buy into doing some of this business

341
00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:41.920
development work. That again a dirty little secret. If a

342
00:19:41.960 --> 00:19:45.440
firm doesn't have clients to do work for, then all

343
00:19:45.480 --> 00:19:48.599
of that expertise that people have don't matter if there's

344
00:19:48.640 --> 00:19:50.440
no clients to use that expertise on.

345
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:53.440
So true, so true. Our marketing friends don't mind that

346
00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:57.640
we say the following, But to those non selling professionals, we.

347
00:19:57.640 --> 00:19:59.720
Call it marketing or client development.

348
00:20:01.119 --> 00:20:05.440
Absolutely business development, anything but sales. That's a five letter,

349
00:20:05.480 --> 00:20:06.240
four letter word.

350
00:20:06.480 --> 00:20:11.680
That's right, that's right. And you developed that specialty because

351
00:20:11.680 --> 00:20:12.240
you were one.

352
00:20:13.920 --> 00:20:17.720
Two things. Developed that specialty because I was one and

353
00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:22.240
that was my background. Second, like all great plans, it

354
00:20:22.319 --> 00:20:24.160
happened entirely by accident.

355
00:20:25.079 --> 00:20:27.119
You didn't plan that at like nineteen years old.

356
00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:30.119
I didn't plan that at nineteen years old. Soon after

357
00:20:30.200 --> 00:20:33.720
I joined my parents in our sales spinning business. Yeah,

358
00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:37.759
one of my father's top clients was a financial advisor.

359
00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:40.880
His top client was the managing partner of a law

360
00:20:40.880 --> 00:20:44.319
firm who was very disappointed because he looked to sell

361
00:20:44.359 --> 00:20:47.839
his firm and he had developed about ninety five percent

362
00:20:47.839 --> 00:20:50.200
of the business for the firm and was told that

363
00:20:50.240 --> 00:20:54.559
the firm wasn't worth anything without him. So that financial

364
00:20:54.599 --> 00:20:57.640
advisor introduced us to the managing partner of the law firm.

365
00:20:58.160 --> 00:21:00.279
We ended up working with about ten or caul of

366
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:03.680
associates to that law firm, who then referred us to

367
00:21:03.720 --> 00:21:07.160
another law firm, who then referred us to another law firm,

368
00:21:07.240 --> 00:21:10.039
who then referred us to an accounting firm, and then,

369
00:21:10.119 --> 00:21:13.480
all of the sudden, by accident, we started to make

370
00:21:13.519 --> 00:21:19.079
ourselves experts in adopting sales and business development. For those

371
00:21:19.079 --> 00:21:21.279
people who are in professional services.

372
00:21:22.279 --> 00:21:24.519
Love it, so let me just for the audience's sake,

373
00:21:25.920 --> 00:21:29.599
non selling professionals do things a little differently than someone

374
00:21:29.680 --> 00:21:33.240
selling software or real estate or you know, fill in

375
00:21:33.279 --> 00:21:36.920
the blank. Describe just a couple of those easy to

376
00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:39.480
understand differences. For example, they're not going to pick up

377
00:21:39.519 --> 00:21:42.599
the phone and make place calls and make cold calls

378
00:21:42.599 --> 00:21:43.839
as an attorney or CPA.

379
00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:49.480
Correct. So one of the biggest differences is that attorney

380
00:21:49.720 --> 00:21:54.200
that CPA, they are spending the overwhelming majority of their

381
00:21:54.240 --> 00:21:58.440
time actually doing the client work. Most of them are

382
00:21:58.599 --> 00:22:02.920
billing somewhere between eighteen hundred hours and twenty two hundred

383
00:22:02.920 --> 00:22:07.240
hours a year. Therefore, when they're looking at business development,

384
00:22:07.960 --> 00:22:11.079
they really only have about three to five hours per

385
00:22:11.119 --> 00:22:16.839
week for business development. So they need to do things

386
00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:19.920
that are a little bit different than somebody who's selling

387
00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:23.319
forty to fifty sixty hours a week so that they

388
00:22:23.440 --> 00:22:27.279
can leverage their expertise, they can make the best use

389
00:22:27.319 --> 00:22:30.480
of their time to start to get results, and for

390
00:22:30.599 --> 00:22:33.480
a number of them, attorneys being the big one. There

391
00:22:33.480 --> 00:22:38.599
are also ethics and rules around solicitation, and there's things

392
00:22:38.640 --> 00:22:41.440
that most salespeople wouldn't think twice about in terms of

393
00:22:41.480 --> 00:22:44.440
sending out an email, in terms of getting a client's

394
00:22:44.480 --> 00:22:47.920
third party endorsement and using that third party endorsement that

395
00:22:48.039 --> 00:22:53.119
professionals like attorneys ethically and legally can't do. So it

396
00:22:53.240 --> 00:22:57.039
looks and sounds and feels a little bit different when

397
00:22:57.079 --> 00:22:59.200
they're selling what they're doing and when they're trying to

398
00:22:59.240 --> 00:23:02.519
develop a book of business versus your traditional salesperson.

399
00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:06.480
You actually wrote a book about it. Author of selling

400
00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:10.240
professional services, the same other way. Nobody loved the subtitle.

401
00:23:10.359 --> 00:23:13.759
Nobody ever told me I'd have to sell. And that's

402
00:23:13.799 --> 00:23:16.279
quite true, right, Yeah.

403
00:23:16.279 --> 00:23:19.799
For a lot of these folks, especially the ones who

404
00:23:19.799 --> 00:23:23.640
are working in larger firms, at the beginning of their career,

405
00:23:23.880 --> 00:23:26.640
they're told bill twenty three hundred hours, bill twenty five

406
00:23:26.720 --> 00:23:29.640
hundred hours, Bill as much as you can, and then

407
00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:31.960
as it comes time for them to start to be

408
00:23:32.039 --> 00:23:35.680
considered to be a partner, whether it's six, eight, ten,

409
00:23:35.799 --> 00:23:39.640
twelve years into their career, it's oh, by the way,

410
00:23:40.400 --> 00:23:42.720
if you don't have a million dollar book of business,

411
00:23:43.279 --> 00:23:46.920
we couldn't even consider making you a partner. And for

412
00:23:47.000 --> 00:23:49.319
a lot of those attorneys, there's accountants, it's like, well,

413
00:23:49.599 --> 00:23:52.039
wait a second. You've had me in this back office,

414
00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:55.279
you know, billing fifty hours a week for the last

415
00:23:55.319 --> 00:23:58.160
ten years. How was I supposed to build a book

416
00:23:58.160 --> 00:24:00.240
of business? I didn't even know I was supposed to

417
00:24:00.279 --> 00:24:02.440
do it. And it's like, yeah, well now you know.

418
00:24:02.640 --> 00:24:05.960
And if you don't do it, then you're not going

419
00:24:06.039 --> 00:24:09.160
to make partner. And quite frankly, for a lot of them,

420
00:24:09.160 --> 00:24:10.720
they may not have a lot of control over their

421
00:24:10.759 --> 00:24:13.400
career because they're getting built out at a lot more

422
00:24:13.440 --> 00:24:16.559
expensive rate than somebody who's got half the experience. And

423
00:24:16.640 --> 00:24:19.079
for some firms it's okay, well unless you have a

424
00:24:19.119 --> 00:24:24.079
really niche expertise. If there's no we may make you

425
00:24:24.200 --> 00:24:28.240
of counsel. We may have to move you out if

426
00:24:28.240 --> 00:24:30.160
you don't, at some point in time start to develop

427
00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:32.960
a book of business. So it's a catch twenty two.

428
00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:36.160
And for a lot of them it becomes very frustrating

429
00:24:36.680 --> 00:24:39.119
because this is something that nobody told them in law

430
00:24:39.119 --> 00:24:40.319
school that they were going to have to do it.

431
00:24:40.319 --> 00:24:43.559
There's no law school classes on business development, there's no

432
00:24:43.720 --> 00:24:47.079
cl classes on business development, and now all of a sudden,

433
00:24:47.319 --> 00:24:50.240
if you don't do this, you may not make partner

434
00:24:50.240 --> 00:24:52.319
and you're certainly not going to have control over your

435
00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:55.480
own career if you can't develop a book of business.

436
00:24:56.359 --> 00:24:58.000
Why did you decide to write the book?

437
00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:03.640
So a couple of reasons. One there was a need.

438
00:25:05.440 --> 00:25:09.720
Two was asked to tap on the shoulder by Dave,

439
00:25:10.160 --> 00:25:13.079
who had said, you know, by the way you know

440
00:25:13.599 --> 00:25:16.079
you and your father, you're doing you know, as much,

441
00:25:16.079 --> 00:25:18.359
if not more than, this kind of work than anybody else.

442
00:25:18.960 --> 00:25:20.720
You know, do you think that you'd be able to

443
00:25:20.759 --> 00:25:23.680
sit down and you know, kind of help put the

444
00:25:23.839 --> 00:25:29.519
put the Sandler process together and share how it works

445
00:25:29.559 --> 00:25:32.759
for those professional services, for those attorneys, for those accountants,

446
00:25:32.799 --> 00:25:38.160
for those consultants. So it was a labor of the

447
00:25:38.200 --> 00:25:40.039
best thing I ever did one time and I'll ever

448
00:25:40.079 --> 00:25:45.319
do ever again. We turned the book around, probably went

449
00:25:45.440 --> 00:25:48.039
from concept to the book was out there in about

450
00:25:48.079 --> 00:25:52.119
eight to ten months, well, and people really enjoyed it

451
00:25:52.119 --> 00:25:56.039
because it was really a practical approach to business development,

452
00:25:56.079 --> 00:25:59.160
looking at again, what mindset do we need to do,

453
00:26:00.200 --> 00:26:02.559
how are we going to get in front of the opportunities,

454
00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:06.960
and then utilizing that Sandler process and adopting it for

455
00:26:07.160 --> 00:26:10.599
those professional service folks, and putting two or three stories

456
00:26:10.599 --> 00:26:13.039
and the stories we're taking from our experiences with our

457
00:26:13.079 --> 00:26:16.599
clients in terms of giving real world examples of how

458
00:26:16.640 --> 00:26:19.480
each of the concepts applied to those folks.

459
00:26:20.559 --> 00:26:22.440
There are a lot of authors in the audience and

460
00:26:22.440 --> 00:26:24.440
there are a lot of want to be, you know, could

461
00:26:24.519 --> 00:26:28.359
be should be authors. What was the process of writing

462
00:26:28.359 --> 00:26:31.000
the book? Like you said, eight to ten months, and

463
00:26:31.079 --> 00:26:32.640
you didn't say it in a fun I mean you

464
00:26:32.640 --> 00:26:34.799
didn't say it like it was exciting. It sounded like

465
00:26:34.799 --> 00:26:36.759
it was work. While you're doing your rest the rest

466
00:26:36.759 --> 00:26:39.759
of your work, you know, but going to take us

467
00:26:39.759 --> 00:26:40.440
through the process.

468
00:26:41.279 --> 00:26:46.640
So it was really developing an outline of Okay, what

469
00:26:46.759 --> 00:26:49.839
do we want to accomplish, Yeah, if the book's written,

470
00:26:49.880 --> 00:26:51.359
at the end of the book, what do we want

471
00:26:51.400 --> 00:26:55.119
people to walk away from? And then breaking it down

472
00:26:55.200 --> 00:26:59.599
and quite frankly, we wrote the first chapter and the

473
00:26:59.680 --> 00:27:03.319
last chapter. First kind of ran that through people to

474
00:27:03.400 --> 00:27:06.680
make sure that that's something that people thought would bring value.

475
00:27:07.400 --> 00:27:09.200
And then from there it was okay, how do we

476
00:27:09.240 --> 00:27:13.720
break this down into bite sized chunks? So how do

477
00:27:13.799 --> 00:27:17.119
we make it done in such a way where it's

478
00:27:17.279 --> 00:27:20.000
easy to read and easy to utilize and not like

479
00:27:20.279 --> 00:27:24.119
reading through a textbook. And quite frankly, and you know,

480
00:27:24.200 --> 00:27:26.160
I was with Sandler Training at the time, and they

481
00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:29.519
had a ghostwriter who helped us once we got all

482
00:27:29.559 --> 00:27:33.880
of the content in there, to change some things around

483
00:27:33.880 --> 00:27:35.519
a little bit, and again to make it a little

484
00:27:35.519 --> 00:27:39.799
bit more digestible, a little bit more readable. But it

485
00:27:39.839 --> 00:27:42.279
was just a matter of Okay, what's the start, what's

486
00:27:42.319 --> 00:27:46.559
the end, what are the different pieces? And then for

487
00:27:46.680 --> 00:27:51.319
us with a business book, almost having each chapter have

488
00:27:51.440 --> 00:27:55.119
the ability to be a standalone and that was much easier,

489
00:27:55.160 --> 00:27:58.839
quite frankly, to write, as well as I think easier

490
00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:01.119
for people to pick it up, look at two or

491
00:28:01.160 --> 00:28:03.720
three chapters and be able to get something from it

492
00:28:03.799 --> 00:28:06.519
without having me go through the whole thing from beginning

493
00:28:06.599 --> 00:28:07.640
to end in one shot.

494
00:28:09.039 --> 00:28:11.119
All right, we're going to take our second break right here.

495
00:28:11.319 --> 00:28:14.279
We'll be back in about another minute. When we come back,

496
00:28:14.319 --> 00:28:17.400
we'll talk about your transition out of the franchise and

497
00:28:17.480 --> 00:28:20.680
into kind of well little bit of a transition period

498
00:28:20.720 --> 00:28:22.759
into the work you do now. So we'll be back

499
00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:24.559
in about another minute with Evan Poland.

500
00:28:28.359 --> 00:28:32.319
You're listening to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helenet on

501
00:28:32.559 --> 00:28:36.519
W four CY Radio. That's W four cy dot com.

502
00:28:36.720 --> 00:28:39.359
Don't go away. More helpful information is coming right up

503
00:28:39.599 --> 00:28:41.759
right here on Winning Business Radio.

504
00:28:44.200 --> 00:28:47.119
The yp dot com website is your local search engine.

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515
00:29:18.160 --> 00:29:21.000
And now back to Winning Business Radio with Kevin Helene

516
00:29:21.200 --> 00:29:25.039
presenting exciting topics and expert guests with one goal in

517
00:29:25.119 --> 00:29:28.640
mind to help you succeed in business. Here once again

518
00:29:28.960 --> 00:29:33.759
is Kevin Helene.

519
00:29:38.559 --> 00:29:42.039
So of an after eighteen looks like about eighteen and

520
00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:44.440
a half years, and I want to ask you a

521
00:29:44.440 --> 00:29:48.039
couple of questions along that way too. You guys decided

522
00:29:48.079 --> 00:29:52.079
to exit from the Sanla franchise, sell it. I'm whatever,

523
00:29:52.160 --> 00:29:55.200
I'm not. That part doesn't concern me. I'm interested in

524
00:29:55.400 --> 00:29:59.079
you know why he decided to make a transition so well.

525
00:29:58.960 --> 00:30:03.720
The eight figure off didn't hurt. But in addition to that,

526
00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:11.160
our franchise agreement was coming up. Our very expensive Center

527
00:30:11.200 --> 00:30:15.039
City Philadelphia office space lease was coming up. Within about

528
00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:17.920
two or three months of the franchise agreement coming up,

529
00:30:18.839 --> 00:30:22.200
my father was in his seventies and looking to slow down,

530
00:30:22.200 --> 00:30:25.319
and he was my primary business partner. I was getting

531
00:30:25.359 --> 00:30:28.559
a little burnout and the office was about forty five

532
00:30:28.599 --> 00:30:33.440
minutes to hour commute from where I lived, in addition

533
00:30:33.559 --> 00:30:37.359
to networking events those kinds of things. And my largest

534
00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:40.079
client at the time, along with those non selling professionals,

535
00:30:40.559 --> 00:30:43.519
was a corporate tax firm and I was doing training.

536
00:30:43.559 --> 00:30:45.440
It was an ESOP, so I was doing training for

537
00:30:45.480 --> 00:30:49.759
about twenty two of their partners and they wanted to

538
00:30:49.799 --> 00:30:53.359
carve out a larger role for me, so we decided

539
00:30:53.359 --> 00:30:58.599
to exit the franchise. Fortunately for us, timing could not

540
00:30:58.640 --> 00:31:00.920
have been any better. I think we did the franchise

541
00:31:00.960 --> 00:31:04.880
about six months before COVID hit and if we had

542
00:31:04.920 --> 00:31:08.039
stayed in, I would have signed a brand new ten

543
00:31:08.119 --> 00:31:13.079
year office lease and would have made things challenging. And

544
00:31:13.160 --> 00:31:16.480
I was with this corporate tax firm for about three

545
00:31:16.559 --> 00:31:21.759
years doing my own business development for them, acting essentially

546
00:31:21.759 --> 00:31:24.240
as the sales manager for all of their directors.

547
00:31:25.599 --> 00:31:29.240
But pause that thought for a second. What was your

548
00:31:30.319 --> 00:31:32.759
This is a hard question, maybe not too hard, but

549
00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:35.079
certainly you got to think about it. What was your

550
00:31:35.119 --> 00:31:38.839
most important takeaway from eighteen and a half years running

551
00:31:38.839 --> 00:31:41.319
your own business and probably something you really enjoyed.

552
00:31:42.599 --> 00:31:45.680
So two things. One for any of you small business

553
00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:49.079
owners out there, you know running business is not easy,

554
00:31:49.880 --> 00:31:55.400
so yeah, it takes a certain type in two. You know,

555
00:31:55.519 --> 00:31:58.440
one of the other things I learned is that nobody

556
00:31:58.480 --> 00:32:02.039
is successful on their own, and it's really a matter

557
00:32:02.119 --> 00:32:05.839
of surrounding yourself with the right people, you know, having

558
00:32:05.880 --> 00:32:09.200
the right partners, having the right you know, having folks

559
00:32:09.200 --> 00:32:11.640
that you can lean on, as well as really enjoying

560
00:32:11.640 --> 00:32:15.799
what you're doing is really the key. At that point

561
00:32:15.839 --> 00:32:17.400
in time, I had just kind of been a little

562
00:32:17.400 --> 00:32:21.079
burnout in terms of what I was doing, and again,

563
00:32:21.240 --> 00:32:24.119
my partner at the time was transitioning out, so I

564
00:32:24.200 --> 00:32:25.799
just thought that at that point in time it was

565
00:32:25.839 --> 00:32:27.559
a good time to step away.

566
00:32:28.119 --> 00:32:30.160
So tell us now more about Global The company I

567
00:32:30.200 --> 00:32:33.079
believe was Global Tax Management, right, yep.

568
00:32:33.279 --> 00:32:37.640
So the firm was Global Tax Management, which essentially does

569
00:32:38.079 --> 00:32:42.359
corporate tax for fortune and five hundred and fortune one

570
00:32:42.359 --> 00:32:47.119
thousand companies, so placing people in your tax departments, helping

571
00:32:47.160 --> 00:32:50.480
them with very technical things. So there are about eight

572
00:32:50.559 --> 00:32:56.000
different groups within it, everything from international tax to tax technology.

573
00:32:56.640 --> 00:33:03.160
So essentially I was a sales manager for all of

574
00:33:03.160 --> 00:33:06.759
the different directors in terms of helping them with accountability,

575
00:33:08.039 --> 00:33:11.519
helping you know, to coach them through strategize the opportunities.

576
00:33:12.680 --> 00:33:16.599
Much like many other professional service firms, they would do

577
00:33:16.680 --> 00:33:18.720
webinars and a lot of things like that, and then

578
00:33:18.759 --> 00:33:22.240
nobody would follow up on any of the people. They

579
00:33:22.240 --> 00:33:24.279
would just hope that the phone would ring if somebody

580
00:33:24.359 --> 00:33:25.319
liked the webinar enough.

581
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:26.599
I don't believe it.

582
00:33:27.119 --> 00:33:30.400
Yeah, So, and I actually worked very closely with their

583
00:33:30.440 --> 00:33:33.960
CMO because they had one or two b D folks

584
00:33:33.960 --> 00:33:36.759
in the past who weren't really working with the CMO.

585
00:33:37.000 --> 00:33:40.319
So really making sure that sales and marketing were on

586
00:33:40.359 --> 00:33:43.640
the same page for the firm, which really helped the

587
00:33:43.640 --> 00:33:47.720
firm in terms of the results that they got. But

588
00:33:48.599 --> 00:33:51.880
I learned after not that long, I'm a much better

589
00:33:52.079 --> 00:33:55.359
entrepreneur than I am an employee.

590
00:33:56.400 --> 00:33:58.160
Yeah, I feel you on that one.

591
00:33:58.960 --> 00:34:05.920
So therefore, so so therefore, I decided to step away.

592
00:34:06.000 --> 00:34:08.760
And when I went back and thought about what I

593
00:34:08.800 --> 00:34:12.599
had done with the franchise, what I really enjoyed most,

594
00:34:12.800 --> 00:34:16.360
and this goes back to my counseling roots, was the

595
00:34:16.559 --> 00:34:20.840
one on one coaching that I did and really, you know,

596
00:34:21.480 --> 00:34:24.599
working with folks, you know, on that kind of intimate level,

597
00:34:25.639 --> 00:34:28.800
and I found that my clients really saw the impact

598
00:34:29.760 --> 00:34:32.000
and I really enjoyed it. And I also really found

599
00:34:32.039 --> 00:34:36.320
and reflecting that I got the most out of working

600
00:34:36.360 --> 00:34:41.239
with solopreneurs, working with people from very small firms. They

601
00:34:41.239 --> 00:34:45.280
could immediately see the impact of what we were doing

602
00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:48.880
together and how it impacted their business. So I decided

603
00:34:48.920 --> 00:34:52.400
when I went back out to really just focus on

604
00:34:52.519 --> 00:34:57.639
that individual coaching work, you know, more with the professional

605
00:34:57.679 --> 00:35:02.039
service firms still than anybody else, but really doing that

606
00:35:02.159 --> 00:35:05.679
customized kind of one on one work. You're looking at

607
00:35:05.719 --> 00:35:11.239
the accountability and doing that versus doing the large group training.

608
00:35:11.559 --> 00:35:14.800
And again that that counseling piece of me was really

609
00:35:14.840 --> 00:35:19.719
fulfilled by doing that long one. I really enjoy working

610
00:35:19.719 --> 00:35:24.320
with those solopreneurs, those entrepreneurs, those really small firms. So

611
00:35:24.360 --> 00:35:27.360
that's really where I've settled into over the last two

612
00:35:27.400 --> 00:35:29.000
and a half years or so.

613
00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:30.920
So the owners often the seller doer.

614
00:35:32.280 --> 00:35:36.239
Very oftentimes the owner is the seller doer, or if

615
00:35:36.280 --> 00:35:39.760
it's a small firm, again the managing partner is bringing

616
00:35:39.760 --> 00:35:42.480
in one hundred percent of the business and they would

617
00:35:42.599 --> 00:35:45.440
make one or two of their associates to start to

618
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:48.280
help with that business development work.

619
00:35:49.320 --> 00:35:52.840
And do you help onboard hire and on board attorneys

620
00:35:53.239 --> 00:35:55.480
professional services people. Is that a part of what you do?

621
00:35:56.159 --> 00:36:01.239
So I will do that a little bit. I'm more

622
00:36:01.599 --> 00:36:05.800
just in the Okay, what is your individual strategy, what

623
00:36:05.880 --> 00:36:08.280
are your goals? How are we going to help you

624
00:36:08.320 --> 00:36:11.280
to hit those goals? And giving people some tools and

625
00:36:11.320 --> 00:36:15.079
some tactics. And again, in those really small firms, managing

626
00:36:15.159 --> 00:36:18.760
partner the owner doesn't have the time or the expertise

627
00:36:19.280 --> 00:36:22.599
to hold that person accountable. So really acting as that

628
00:36:22.679 --> 00:36:27.440
accountability piece for those folks since the owner managing partner

629
00:36:27.519 --> 00:36:30.760
really doesn't have the time the expertise to be able

630
00:36:30.760 --> 00:36:31.079
to do that.

631
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:34.639
So I want to touch on a few specific areas.

632
00:36:34.880 --> 00:36:38.400
These are some of the specific services that you bring

633
00:36:38.440 --> 00:36:41.199
to your clients development. I'll just give you the bullet

634
00:36:41.199 --> 00:36:42.599
and just touch on it for a minute or so.

635
00:36:43.000 --> 00:36:46.599
Develop a high level sales and business development strategy.

636
00:36:48.119 --> 00:36:53.360
Yeah, so especially those solopreneurs. I'll talk to them and

637
00:36:53.400 --> 00:36:55.760
you'll tell me how much business they'd like to do,

638
00:36:56.679 --> 00:36:59.039
and that maybe they've got a client or two if

639
00:36:59.079 --> 00:37:01.079
they've just started their own for somebody's come with them,

640
00:37:01.480 --> 00:37:05.920
but they have no idea, Yeah, how many clients they need?

641
00:37:06.320 --> 00:37:08.719
You know, what a small, medium, large sized client should

642
00:37:08.760 --> 00:37:09.119
look like.

643
00:37:09.639 --> 00:37:11.679
Their goal is to make as much money as possible.

644
00:37:11.679 --> 00:37:15.280
Their goal is to bring in as many clients as possible, right,

645
00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:15.920
or their.

646
00:37:15.800 --> 00:37:18.320
Goal is, hey, you know I you know, I want

647
00:37:18.360 --> 00:37:20.840
more like work life balance. You know, I'd like to

648
00:37:20.880 --> 00:37:23.199
have a practice of three hundred thousand dollars. I'd like

649
00:37:23.239 --> 00:37:25.679
to have a practice of six hundred thousand dollars. But

650
00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:29.800
they have no idea how to get there. So it's

651
00:37:29.840 --> 00:37:32.559
a matter of sitting down looking at the goal, breaking

652
00:37:32.599 --> 00:37:36.639
it down into pieces, helping them identify how many clients

653
00:37:36.639 --> 00:37:39.159
they're going to need, and then what is that strategy

654
00:37:39.199 --> 00:37:41.599
going to be in terms of how they're going to

655
00:37:41.639 --> 00:37:45.400
get in front of those folks, because a lot of

656
00:37:45.440 --> 00:37:48.800
folks haven't even thought about it, or even a business

657
00:37:48.880 --> 00:37:53.639
owner will hire a salesperson and they they'll say, well, geez,

658
00:37:53.679 --> 00:37:55.519
you know, this is how I did it twenty years ago.

659
00:37:56.159 --> 00:37:58.039
If you know, they've been in business for a long time,

660
00:37:58.639 --> 00:38:01.559
but you know, what happened work twenty years ago probably

661
00:38:01.599 --> 00:38:03.599
isn't going to work as well today. So they can't

662
00:38:03.639 --> 00:38:07.039
help that new hire with what the strategy should be.

663
00:38:07.079 --> 00:38:10.039
And again, they're doing fifteen other things, so they're not

664
00:38:10.079 --> 00:38:13.480
really helping with the accountability in terms of tracking what

665
00:38:13.519 --> 00:38:16.079
that person is doing to see if they're doing the

666
00:38:16.119 --> 00:38:16.880
right things to be.

667
00:38:16.840 --> 00:38:22.280
Successful, changes in outreach, changes in networking, changes in social selling, right.

668
00:38:23.000 --> 00:38:27.159
Absolutely, And yeah, how do you leverage LinkedIn? How do

669
00:38:27.199 --> 00:38:30.280
you leverage your personal network to do a better job

670
00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:33.639
with referrals, introductions, you know, those kinds of things.

671
00:38:34.880 --> 00:38:39.079
And then you said the personalized coaching, how often do

672
00:38:39.119 --> 00:38:41.880
you This is fairly you know, I'm just saying, typically

673
00:38:41.960 --> 00:38:43.519
meet with somebody one on one.

674
00:38:44.679 --> 00:38:47.880
Typically, at least at the beginning, I'm meeting with somebody

675
00:38:47.880 --> 00:38:52.280
on a weekly basis. Over time, that might go down

676
00:38:52.360 --> 00:38:56.559
to twice a month, But it's really that regular interaction

677
00:38:57.199 --> 00:39:00.440
to make sure that once we've got a strategy in place,

678
00:39:01.400 --> 00:39:05.119
are they putting that strategy into action, and then what's

679
00:39:05.199 --> 00:39:07.679
working and what's not working, so that we can tweak

680
00:39:07.719 --> 00:39:11.119
that strategy along the way so that they can determine

681
00:39:11.119 --> 00:39:12.639
what's getting them and the best results.

682
00:39:13.320 --> 00:39:17.159
You're assessing strengths and weaknesses probably of the individual as

683
00:39:17.159 --> 00:39:19.559
well as perhaps the small team, and you're going to

684
00:39:19.559 --> 00:39:22.599
provide training specific to those strengths and weaknesses.

685
00:39:23.239 --> 00:39:27.039
Correct training specifically those strengths and weaknesses. Again, if there's

686
00:39:27.079 --> 00:39:29.599
two or three people I'm working with from the same firm,

687
00:39:30.159 --> 00:39:32.559
I may work with them on a couple of concepts.

688
00:39:33.119 --> 00:39:37.159
But then if Mary has been around for twenty years

689
00:39:37.639 --> 00:39:40.400
and has a huge network to leverage, we're going to

690
00:39:40.480 --> 00:39:43.559
focus with her on how to leverage her network. If

691
00:39:43.679 --> 00:39:46.760
Joe's only been around for three or four years, Joe

692
00:39:46.840 --> 00:39:50.400
may need to join a b and I a chamber,

693
00:39:50.639 --> 00:39:54.639
do other things to first grow his network and do

694
00:39:54.760 --> 00:39:57.079
different things than Mary. And that's where the one on

695
00:39:57.079 --> 00:39:59.760
one really comes in to help each person with what

696
00:39:59.800 --> 00:40:03.119
they should individually be doing. And as you know, there's

697
00:40:03.199 --> 00:40:06.679
fifteen eighteen different things that people could be doing when

698
00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:09.960
it comes to prospecting, and anybody can really only do

699
00:40:10.119 --> 00:40:12.679
three to five at the same time. So looking at

700
00:40:12.719 --> 00:40:15.719
that person's strengths and weaknesses to help them figure out

701
00:40:15.719 --> 00:40:18.880
which ones they should try first, and then how to

702
00:40:19.000 --> 00:40:21.480
track what's working what's not working. With most of my

703
00:40:21.519 --> 00:40:23.719
clients at the end of the year, we'll look at

704
00:40:23.719 --> 00:40:27.119
all of the professional associations they belong to, all of

705
00:40:27.159 --> 00:40:31.679
the networking things, see what's see what's working, see what's

706
00:40:31.679 --> 00:40:35.599
not working, to then be able to help you tweak

707
00:40:35.639 --> 00:40:37.360
what they're doing so that they can make the best

708
00:40:37.440 --> 00:40:38.079
use of their time.

709
00:40:39.159 --> 00:40:41.840
And then you or how often I should say, do

710
00:40:41.880 --> 00:40:47.400
you function as a formal fractional sales manager, So.

711
00:40:48.559 --> 00:40:52.360
Really maybe for two to three clients per year, so

712
00:40:52.400 --> 00:40:55.760
I will do a little bit of that. Quite frankly,

713
00:40:55.840 --> 00:40:58.760
I'm doing more of just the individual.

714
00:40:58.199 --> 00:41:02.639
Coaching in acting mind, so we know a fractional means

715
00:41:02.679 --> 00:41:05.000
to find what it looks like as a fractional sales leader.

716
00:41:05.960 --> 00:41:10.519
A fractional sales leader oftentimes is integrating themselves more within

717
00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:15.159
the organization that they're working with, helping from everything from

718
00:41:15.880 --> 00:41:18.639
recruiting onboarding.

719
00:41:18.360 --> 00:41:20.639
Train meetings, pipeline reviews.

720
00:41:20.320 --> 00:41:26.199
Sales meetings, accountability, employee reviews, all of those kinds of things,

721
00:41:26.760 --> 00:41:30.039
and at least from my perspective, really being a lot

722
00:41:30.079 --> 00:41:33.360
more integrated within the organization that they're acting as a

723
00:41:33.360 --> 00:41:38.119
fractional sales leader with versus the coaching which sometimes is

724
00:41:38.159 --> 00:41:41.840
a little bit more arms length and really giving people

725
00:41:41.880 --> 00:41:46.000
the tools, doing a little bit with the accountability. But

726
00:41:46.119 --> 00:41:48.880
I find, at least in my experience, that there's more

727
00:41:48.920 --> 00:41:52.360
expected out of that fractional sales leader.

728
00:41:52.079 --> 00:41:54.719
Right right, that's a fixed number of hours per week

729
00:41:54.760 --> 00:41:55.119
or month.

730
00:41:55.800 --> 00:41:57.719
That's a fixed number of hours per week per month.

731
00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:01.760
I also find that there are others much better suited

732
00:42:02.559 --> 00:42:06.920
to help organizations with the infrastructure with the compensation plan.

733
00:42:07.679 --> 00:42:11.320
And I'd rather have someone who really specializes in that

734
00:42:12.360 --> 00:42:15.599
work with the company when they're looking for that, right,

735
00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:19.199
versus you know, doing more of the you know, individual coaching.

736
00:42:19.559 --> 00:42:22.159
Right. Yeah, I'm with you on that. Sales acceleration comes

737
00:42:22.199 --> 00:42:24.760
to mind. It sounds like who you were referring to there, yep.

738
00:42:24.920 --> 00:42:27.800
So so sales acceleration is a really great example of

739
00:42:28.679 --> 00:42:30.760
of an organization you know that does that and does

740
00:42:30.760 --> 00:42:31.400
that well.

741
00:42:31.440 --> 00:42:34.599
Yep, we have I know you do. We have relationships

742
00:42:34.599 --> 00:42:36.960
with some of those guys. They're good people. What what

743
00:42:37.039 --> 00:42:41.599
are some of the most common business development mistakes you

744
00:42:41.719 --> 00:42:43.679
see clients make before they meet you?

745
00:42:45.159 --> 00:42:49.920
So some of the biggest mistakes is not having a plan.

746
00:42:50.800 --> 00:42:53.119
And the plan is you know, praying really hard at

747
00:42:53.159 --> 00:42:55.199
the beginning of each week, each month or each quarter

748
00:42:56.079 --> 00:42:58.840
and hoping that stuff is not as is going to happen.

749
00:42:59.400 --> 00:42:59.599
Yeah.

750
00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:05.519
Along with having a plan is going back and tracking historically. Okay,

751
00:43:05.599 --> 00:43:08.360
where have my best clients come from? And can I

752
00:43:08.440 --> 00:43:12.760
do more of the kinds of things that lead to that?

753
00:43:13.239 --> 00:43:16.000
And then I think the other thing is people are

754
00:43:16.039 --> 00:43:18.880
too focused on themselves in what I think I bring

755
00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:22.639
to the table versus it looking at Okay, what problems

756
00:43:22.639 --> 00:43:25.480
do I solve for my clients? And how am I

757
00:43:25.519 --> 00:43:28.480
going to articulate that and how can I make it

758
00:43:28.519 --> 00:43:32.719
easy for people to understand how I can help and

759
00:43:32.760 --> 00:43:34.840
how they can see whether or not my help could

760
00:43:34.840 --> 00:43:38.159
be beneficial for them.

761
00:43:38.519 --> 00:43:40.719
Where does most of your business come from at this

762
00:43:40.719 --> 00:43:41.400
point in time?

763
00:43:42.039 --> 00:43:45.760
So I have been very fortunate in twenty some years

764
00:43:45.800 --> 00:43:48.599
of doing this of building up a really good network,

765
00:43:49.079 --> 00:43:52.559
so a large percentage of my business comes from referrals

766
00:43:52.559 --> 00:43:56.039
and introductions. And then you and I are part of

767
00:43:56.039 --> 00:43:58.639
the same professional professional organization. I don't know if we

768
00:43:58.719 --> 00:44:01.400
want to give them a cheap plug go for sure,

769
00:44:03.159 --> 00:44:06.679
We're worth part of a national organization called Provisors, which

770
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:11.440
is really for business advisors who have been doing what

771
00:44:11.440 --> 00:44:14.239
they're doing for ten plus years. And I've been a

772
00:44:14.239 --> 00:44:16.320
part of that for fifteen months, and I found that

773
00:44:16.440 --> 00:44:19.840
to be both a great source of business as well

774
00:44:19.880 --> 00:44:23.360
as a tremendous resource for myself to build relationships with

775
00:44:23.800 --> 00:44:27.239
different coaches and consultants marketing folks that I've then been

776
00:44:27.280 --> 00:44:30.199
able to refer out to my clients to provide additional

777
00:44:30.280 --> 00:44:31.199
value for my clients.

778
00:44:31.559 --> 00:44:37.360
Yeah, exactly the same experience. What is the best lesson

779
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:41.559
you've taught recently or the best lesson you've learned recently?

780
00:44:43.920 --> 00:44:46.440
So great question you said there, We're going to be

781
00:44:46.440 --> 00:44:48.000
no hard hitting questions here.

782
00:44:48.400 --> 00:44:50.119
That's the hardest one Romiston anyway.

783
00:44:52.000 --> 00:44:56.599
So for me, you know, I think the best lesson

784
00:44:57.199 --> 00:45:02.239
for folks is really understand what you want to achieve,

785
00:45:02.280 --> 00:45:05.000
what you want to accomplish. I know, coming into fourth quarter,

786
00:45:05.559 --> 00:45:07.519
I do a lot of goal setting with my clients.

787
00:45:07.559 --> 00:45:09.039
I know that you do a lot of goal setting

788
00:45:09.039 --> 00:45:13.119
with your clients. Is helping people to understand why they're

789
00:45:13.159 --> 00:45:17.039
working so hard and kind of big picture what they're

790
00:45:17.079 --> 00:45:19.400
looking to accomplish and what's going to make them happy,

791
00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:22.719
and then building a plan around that. I still think

792
00:45:22.760 --> 00:45:25.960
that these days, people too often feel like they're judged

793
00:45:26.000 --> 00:45:28.559
by how much money they make. And there are people

794
00:45:28.559 --> 00:45:30.639
who are going out there and how can I make

795
00:45:30.679 --> 00:45:34.119
every last dollar? But then their relationships aren't any good,

796
00:45:34.559 --> 00:45:37.039
their health isn't any good. And I think when you

797
00:45:37.119 --> 00:45:40.599
have a better understanding of what's really important, you can

798
00:45:40.639 --> 00:45:43.960
then build a plan around that and be really happy

799
00:45:44.000 --> 00:45:47.360
and be really balanced. And I think it all starts there.

800
00:45:48.079 --> 00:45:50.800
I love it. That's excellent. To that point, what do

801
00:45:50.840 --> 00:45:52.239
you like to do in networking? What do you like

802
00:45:52.280 --> 00:45:52.920
to do for fun?

803
00:45:53.559 --> 00:45:58.519
So great question. So my dog Harper is named Harper

804
00:45:58.559 --> 00:46:03.119
for a reason after Bryce Harper. Well, we got soon

805
00:46:03.199 --> 00:46:06.280
after the Phillies acquired Brice Harper. So I am a

806
00:46:06.360 --> 00:46:10.280
huge sports fan. My father and I just took a

807
00:46:10.360 --> 00:46:12.840
trip to New Orleans to see an Eagle Saints game,

808
00:46:12.880 --> 00:46:15.320
and over the last four or five years we've done

809
00:46:15.360 --> 00:46:16.880
a road game together every year.

810
00:46:17.239 --> 00:46:17.519
Nice.

811
00:46:17.920 --> 00:46:21.360
I'm very fortunate that my son my wife are both

812
00:46:21.400 --> 00:46:24.679
big sports fans, so we do that together. I'm also

813
00:46:24.719 --> 00:46:27.280
a big believer and again that work life balance and

814
00:46:27.719 --> 00:46:30.800
disconnecting at least once or twice a year. So love

815
00:46:30.920 --> 00:46:34.400
going away on vacation with my family. We're going to

816
00:46:34.440 --> 00:46:39.960
be going down to the Dominican Dominican Republic over Christmas time.

817
00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:42.920
But really being able to disconnect at least once or

818
00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:45.880
twice a year, that's really important as well.

819
00:46:46.199 --> 00:46:49.000
That's really good. I was fortunate enough just to come back.

820
00:46:49.079 --> 00:46:52.199
We were back. So you left the seventeenth of September.

821
00:46:52.880 --> 00:46:54.639
I spoke at a conference in Dallas, but we have

822
00:46:54.679 --> 00:46:56.719
some family there, so we added a couple of days

823
00:46:57.119 --> 00:46:58.639
and then, believe it or not, I spoke at a

824
00:46:58.639 --> 00:47:01.719
conference in Cancun for a client and we added a

825
00:47:01.760 --> 00:47:03.840
couple of days there. So sometimes you can get away

826
00:47:03.840 --> 00:47:04.360
with that too.

827
00:47:04.480 --> 00:47:07.960
But I was most jealous when I soon after I

828
00:47:08.079 --> 00:47:10.840
joined my parents in the business, my father had a

829
00:47:10.840 --> 00:47:14.079
client that had an office in Saint Thomas and got

830
00:47:14.079 --> 00:47:16.159
them to fly him out there and put him up

831
00:47:16.159 --> 00:47:19.280
for several days in Saint Thomas. Nice before and after

832
00:47:19.400 --> 00:47:20.880
the conference he did for them.

833
00:47:21.000 --> 00:47:23.280
You gotta love it, all right, what's the best way

834
00:47:23.320 --> 00:47:25.679
for people to get in touch with you? And one

835
00:47:25.760 --> 00:47:27.760
quick plug? Why should they reach out to you?

836
00:47:28.920 --> 00:47:32.599
So and I appreciate the opportunity for the plug. People

837
00:47:32.639 --> 00:47:35.840
should reach out to me if they're not happy with

838
00:47:35.920 --> 00:47:38.760
the kind of results they're getting from their business development effort,

839
00:47:39.360 --> 00:47:41.840
and they know that they should be doing something different,

840
00:47:41.880 --> 00:47:44.159
but maybe they're not quite sure what it is that

841
00:47:44.199 --> 00:47:47.079
they should be doing. That's a great time and what

842
00:47:47.199 --> 00:47:49.559
I like to say, people should reach out to me

843
00:47:49.639 --> 00:47:53.119
if they're looking to proactively grow their firm, proactively grow

844
00:47:53.159 --> 00:47:56.159
their practice. If they're not looking to proactively do it,

845
00:47:56.199 --> 00:47:58.239
I can be a pain in the butt, you know.

846
00:47:58.320 --> 00:48:00.000
I'm going to ask them to do things that are

847
00:48:00.079 --> 00:48:04.280
going to make them uncomfortable. I'm not cheap, so yeah,

848
00:48:04.320 --> 00:48:06.760
So if somebody really doesn't want to build their business,

849
00:48:07.199 --> 00:48:09.119
you know, probably doesn't make sense for them to give

850
00:48:09.159 --> 00:48:12.679
me a call. Best way to check me out if

851
00:48:12.719 --> 00:48:17.320
you go to my website, which is www dot polandpg

852
00:48:18.159 --> 00:48:21.039
dot com. You can see a little bit more about me,

853
00:48:21.199 --> 00:48:23.599
read some of that. I probably have twenty twenty five

854
00:48:23.639 --> 00:48:28.599
blog articles up there. Or you can email me at

855
00:48:28.719 --> 00:48:34.639
Evan at polandpg P, LIKEPETERG Likegeorge dot com. Those are

856
00:48:34.679 --> 00:48:36.119
the two best ways to get in touch with me.

857
00:48:36.400 --> 00:48:39.320
Perfect Well, thank you so much for your time. I've

858
00:48:39.400 --> 00:48:41.840
enjoyed having you and we appreciate it.

859
00:48:42.599 --> 00:48:44.199
Thanks Kevin, I really appreciate it.

860
00:48:44.400 --> 00:48:47.039
You're quite welcome, and thanks everybody for listening and watching.

861
00:48:47.519 --> 00:48:50.280
This is the show about business and often business challenges.

862
00:48:50.679 --> 00:48:53.159
If you've got concerns about the growth of your company

863
00:48:53.199 --> 00:48:56.239
and you are if you're a non selling professional you

864
00:48:56.280 --> 00:48:58.480
want to reach out to Evan anybody else in any

865
00:48:58.480 --> 00:49:00.800
other walk of life and business, feel free to reach

866
00:49:00.840 --> 00:49:03.800
out to me on Facebook or LinkedIn. That's at Winning

867
00:49:03.880 --> 00:49:06.960
Business Radio. You can email me at one of my

868
00:49:07.000 --> 00:49:10.719
many email addresses. Kevinat Winning Business Radio dot com. Our

869
00:49:10.760 --> 00:49:13.760
company is Winning Incorporated. We're part of Sandler Training. We

870
00:49:13.880 --> 00:49:18.079
develop sales teams into high achievers and sales leaders into

871
00:49:18.119 --> 00:49:21.199
true coaches and mentors. We're not right for everybody, but

872
00:49:21.519 --> 00:49:23.960
maybe we should have a conversation. Thank you to one,

873
00:49:24.119 --> 00:49:26.920
our crack producer and engineer for another job. Well done.

874
00:49:26.920 --> 00:49:30.519
Appreciate it one. Join us again next Monday, October fourteenth,

875
00:49:30.559 --> 00:49:34.280
my guest will be Eric Arenstaft, facilitator, bestselling author, speaker,

876
00:49:34.360 --> 00:49:38.320
and active CEO of Elevate ID. Until then, this is

877
00:49:38.400 --> 00:49:40.800
Kevin Helena.

878
00:49:40.960 --> 00:49:43.760
You've been listening to Winning Business Radio with your host,

879
00:49:43.840 --> 00:49:46.960
Kevin Helena. If you missed any part of this episode,

880
00:49:47.039 --> 00:49:51.199
the podcast is available on Talk for Podcasting and iHeartRadio.

881
00:49:51.639 --> 00:49:55.360
For more information and questions, go to Winning Business Radio

882
00:49:55.480 --> 00:49:58.480
dot com or check us out on social media. Tune

883
00:49:58.519 --> 00:50:00.599
in again next week and every Monday at four pm

884
00:50:00.639 --> 00:50:04.119
Eastern Time to listen live to Winning Business Radio on

885
00:50:04.400 --> 00:50:08.679
W four Cy Radio W four cy dot com. Until then,

886
00:50:09.039 --> 00:50:12.639
let's succeed where others have failed and win in business

887
00:50:12.920 --> 00:50:16.480
with Kevin Helenan and Winning Business Radio